I would like to know if you have succeeded in helping your friends or family SLOW DOWN in their zeal as a JW

by BonaFide 22 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  OnTheWayOut

  I focus mainly on myself and trying to find my own happiness. While I would never turn down a JW seeking help, I don't spin my wheels trying to have conversations with people heavily into their cognitive dissonance. Of course, I will always try to help my wife and my mother. The biggest help one can give family members that don't shun you but don't want to hear any anti-JW talk is to encourage them to think for themselves and try to reach their true-personality (the non-cult personality).

  I thought that my wife was a strong JW when I was an active JW. But as it turns out, she was holding on to my coattails. Once I wasn't going to the Kingdom Hall, she still went but felt free to be "running late" or would occasionally skip meetings. She started cramming her WT study in the car while I was driving with the radio on. She gets a minimum in the field circus. She's still a total believer, but she doesn't keep up with what they teach her to believe. She is attempting to make new friends, but it turns out that they are JW's that don't know me. I wonder that it is because the JW's that know me treat her differently now that her husband is "inactive." That is a huge help to her seeing what conditional friends she has.
• 

  BonaFide
• 

  steve2

  As much as JW members of my family continue to believe it's the Truth, I've noticed much less active involvement - in fact, across the local JW scene, there's not much get up and go with the door to door work. That's the biggest change I've noticed. I'd say some members of my family will keep going to the Kingdom Hall no matter what because that's all they know. But the zeal is very much depleted.
• 

  daniel-p

  Yes, I have. I don't know if you're familiar with my situation, but I stopped all activity over 3 years ago and it was rough going with my wife for a while. However, our marriage is the best its ever been (better, I believe) and she's now fairly inactive herself. She still says she believes in "the truth," but her manner and habits are much more balanced that what they would want her to do. She goes to the SUnday meeting about once every two weeks, hardly ever goes to a midweek meeting, and maybe service once a month. She avoids contact with people from the hall, except one or two friends who themselves aren't core witnesses.

  It's actually very encouraging, and only recently have I even thought about it and compared her activity now to what it was a couple years ago. So far, I'm successful in keeping her close to me and keepingour relationship paramount. We are of one mind and our love for each other is stronger than ever. I never expected her to exit the JWs fully, and just always focussed on complete acceptance and support of her and what she wanted to do. I would recommend the same approach for others.

  -dp (quietly ecstatic)
• 

  daniel-p

  I thought that my wife was a strong JW when I was an active JW. But as it turns out, she was holding on to my coattails. Once I wasn't going to the Kingdom Hall, she still went but felt free to be "running late" or would occasionally skip meetings. She started cramming her WT study in the car while I was driving with the radio on. She gets a minimum in the field circus. She's still a total believer, but she doesn't keep up with what they teach her to believe. She is attempting to make new friends, but it turns out that they are JW's that don't know me. I wonder that it is because the JW's that know me treat her differently now that her husband is "inactive." That is a huge help to her seeing what conditional friends she has.

  Nice to hear this, OTWO. It's kind of sad, in a way, that our wives depended on us for staying strong in "the truth," but on the other hand, not really. I'm not going to fall for the old crap of being a "spiritual head"... that's just a way for the WTS to insert their drum-beater into every household and retain a means to exert guilt on the man if he's not doing everything up to code. It's simply too much pressure, and its unfair. I think it's because the WTS level of "worship" is really just constant going-through-motions, and of course they need someone to crack the whip for that crap--it's not natural to live like that because it inherently burns a person out. If their form of worship was more meaningful and personal, the wife wouldn't be near as dependent on the husband for "headship."
• 

  drew sagan

  Yes. My wife left the Watchtower after about one year of slow progress.

  Some suggestions:

  • Detach your emtions. This is not a game of "proving" that you are right and they (WTS) are wrong. This is about letting people think for themselves.
  • Find ways to agree about the Watchtowers problems, before you ever voice one concern over doctrine. If they do not believe you are challenging the foundations of the group, they may just join in. My wife did all the time. Here is what we talked about:
    • Meetings are out of touch with the membership.
    • Nothing for kids, services to rigid
    • Local needs usually consisted of an Elder trying to shame the congregation
    • Ministry ineffective, most people just going through the motions
    • I many times talked about programs and activities found at other churches. I never said that these things were better, but did highlight the differences. This allowed me to make the point that focusing to much on the end of the world distracted the WTS from reaching out to people in other ways. We would talk many hours about how these sorts of things could actually improve the kingdom hall.
  • I never focused on doctrine, but did stress that the past was important. I never stressed that the past was important because it proved the WTS wrong, instead I stressed the past was important because of the supposed divine selection of the Watchtower in the past.
  • Give the person space. It's all about letting that person come to their own conclusions about the WTS. If you try to force things on them you are asking for disaster.
  • If at all possible, take as much time as you can. The slower the better. Many people who leave the WTS want out as soon as possible and make many mistakes in the process. They can't stand being "in" any longer and get sloppy (arguments, fights, insults, sarcasm).
  • Recognize that you may have not fully recovered from leaving. You are no expert. You are just some guy that gotten out of a cult. Be open and kind, but don't try and "fix" everything with your new facts and logic.
• 

  drew sagan

  OTWO is right. I too thought my wife was a diehard JW. Turned out she was a scared girl who resented most of what the WTS had done to her. As soon as she realized she could open up without and fear of being criticized she started her exit.
• 

  Billy the Ex-Bethelite

  Yeah, I've had a dampening effect. Haven't got any "out" yet. As mentioned, it's often a matter of finding the cracks in others and helping them think just a little. I'm not confrontational, but I'm am cautious. It's usually just casual conversation where they bring something up and I don't spout the usual propaganda.

  For example, in discussing some of the recent changes, rather than the "light gettin' brighter", I've introduced the idea that more things will change... like the no blood policy. Then I pick one of the many points I've learned here and give them as much or as little as they can handle on that subject.

  Another example, when someone goes off on "how close the end is", I'll just remind them that while we want to be in an approved condition, we don't want to be dogmatic like some were about 1975. We don't know when it is coming and don't want to give others the idea that it's just weeks away. Really, we still need the cry of peace and security, who's the King of the North, and other things need time yet to develop. It could yet be many years. If we give false impressions of the nearness, people will conclude that we're some doomsday cult or otherwise deranged with false prophecies.

  But one of the biggest dampening effects I've had? I don't waste time trying to make meeting parts interesting. If it's boring, that's what they get. And if people have a disagreement in the cong, don't bother me, pray to Hojovah about it. But everyone still likes me. They see it's the organization that's uncaring.

  B the X
• 

  AK - Jeff

  I have not succeeded - as far as I know. That is the point.

  This process of getting people to think for themselves is a slow process. Jw's, and to perhaps a lesser extent, people in many other religions too, are not accustomed to thinking. They are trained to ask the pastor, the elders, the clergyman, consult the Bible, the Koran, ask the guru, check a book, pray for guidance. But they are not taught to reason, to think, to inquire within, to consult outside sources.

  This is what we are seeking - isn't it? To help them think. It takes time. Think back to the day your first doubts arose about the organization. Mine began [in the back of my mind, subtly] probably 20 years before I actively sought to understand the 'truth about the TRUTH'.

  None of that is easy to do. As has been said before - everyone reaches a point when it becomes possible/favorable to examine. Until then, all we can do is show them that apostates are not some demented, demonized, idiots willing to die rather than submit to Jehovah. Most will never be convinced, due to the paradigm from which they view the world. Over time, some will be convinced to examine. No one can speed that process IMO for most. If someone had sought to do so in my case, I would likely have run for the hills. Once I was ready, no force could have prevented that examination.

  The process of exit begins from within - always - it is never external in the beginning.

  Jeff
• 

  LUKEWARM

  Yes, to date I have succeeded in "placing" 3 crisis of conscience books with friends and family, 1 In Search of Christian Freedom, and am currently working on placing another 2 crisis books with our friends in the cong...

  They know I love God and am an advocate for change given "doctrines of men" have been introduced into the congregation. I make them aware that I was shocked when I discovered that a governing body member resigned after 50 years of full time service - I just needed to read his story and was impressed with its lack of hatred toward the organization and the issues he raised are ones the org will need to face head on one day...

  It took quite a bit of tactful 'drip feeding' before the books were introduced.
  
  It's much easier if you are still active to help them but the key is THEY NEED TO BE READY FIRST, and this requires patience and tact to help them reason on matters and reach their own conclusions.
  
  Opening a closed mind is a SLOW process...but progress can be made if they are comfortable expressing their views on the issues. I am only still in to help friends and family. I encourage people to voice their opinions about the goings on in the org, I openly criticise things and state that the org needs to change to further align itself with the Bible (to friends and family only), I present arguments as a joke to others (eg beards are not Christian or if you live outside the territory you are unfit to serve in the cong), my meeting parts are devoid of organizational propaganda and often go on tangents...
  
  So while at the meeting or in field service or when we spend time together in a social setting the discussions vary:
  
  Blood is a great topic, eg White blood cells in breast milk - so why does society ban these when Jah has it happening in nature? Blood fractions - why ok to use donated blood and where did they come up with the approved fractions list? (I print out the Jensen letters and give to them to read http://www.ajwrb.org/watchtower/index.shtml or send them a link to Vinny's letter http://newsblaze.com/story/20081209054218zzzz.nb/topstory.html)

  Organ transplants - people died for what when they were banned in the 60's?

  Why is preaching work urgent when half of world's population is not being witnessed to? How will God judge these people? What is our 30 second presentation really achieving? Is God going to judge people on the basis of listening to our magazine presentation? Why are we preaching a different 'good news'?
  
  "1914 Generation" teaching - new light in 95 that it related not to 1914 but to wicked people living at a certain time, then in 2008 changed that to the "anointed"? Did God reveal error to them? How could they be wrong if they are directed?
  
  Why do they stress works when bible says that salvation is gods GIFT through faith in Jesus? Will belonging to an organization save us or faith in Christ and living as best we can to please God? Evildoer executed with Jesus was saved without going to 1 meeting or field service...
  
  Why do we need to report our "service" time to anyone - Didn't Jesus teach that worship is between the individual and God? Were all preachers in first century? etc etc...
  
  They are decent people who see the errors in the organization so much patience is required to keep chipping away and deconstructing things that years of indoctrination have built up
  
  I feel Rays 2 books are important in creating awareness about the issues and in helping them to make an informed decision about their own situation.