The WTS's endpoint of the "70 Years"?

Doug Mason

1. Does the WTS date the end the “70 years” as soon as the Babylonian Exiles returned to the Land, or when they started the building of the altar?

(Ezra 2:68 makes it clear that the returnees arrived early enough for the Exiles to be settled in their own towns (verse 70) well before they started to build the altar in the seventh month of an unidentified year (3:1)).

2. Why were the returnees frightened of the people around them when they started to build the altar (Ezra 3:3)? Who were these people that the exiles were frightened of?

Doug

Alwayshere

The watchtower dates the 70 years from 607 down to 537. And say Jerusalem was desolated for 70 years. The 70 years is not talking about Jerusalem being desolated but "serving the King of Babylon for 70 years." Jeremiah 25:11 and 2Chronicles 36:20 show this. Daniel was taken in 606 so that started the 70 years of serving the King. 606 minus 69 more years= 537. Just like God said.

allelsefails

It is a bunch of crap. They don't apply any meaning to the rebuilding of the Altar - only Destruction of Jerusalem to return of exiles = 70 years.

Narkissos

Alwayshere:

The 70 years is not talking about Jerusalem being desolated but "serving the King of Babylon for 70 years." Jeremiah 25:11 and 2Chronicles 36:20 show this.

Imo 2 Chronicles 36 (see v. 21) assumes a 70-year desolation of the land -- which never happened. Two originally different meanings of the 70 years (neo-Babylonian rule over the region, starting around 605 BC; desolation of Judah, starting in 587/6) are mixed in the redaction of Jeremiah 25:11.

Daniel was taken in 606 so that started the 70 years of serving the King. 606 minus 69 more years= 537. Just like God said.

The "King" was no longer a (neo-)Babylonian in 537.

To Doug Mason's # 2: spot on. The "peoples of the lands" (from the returnees' perspective) are the descendents of those Israelites and Judeans who never went into exile, and continued to occupy the land along (and often mixing) with neighbouring peoples (Ammonites, Moabites, etc.) under the administration of Samaria. They were the owners of the land (according to the earlier meaning of the expression). This means that although severely depopulated in some places (especially the Jerusalem area) the territory of Judah (and a fortiori Benjamin) was never totally uninhabited as the WT believes. What Ezra-Nehemiah shows is the controversial establishment of a new centre of power in Jerusalem, based on Cyrus' mandate, against the existing centre in Samaria, and the ideology of the returnees viewing themselves as the "remnant" of true Israel and others as mere Gentiles -- an ideology which will influence the overarching pattern of the dominant "Biblical" historiography, Exodus, Conquest, United Kingdom...

Alwayshere

Sorry, done my math wrong. The Bible at Jeremiah 29:10 does show they would be in Babylon for 70 years. Daniel was taken in 606. Daniel 1:1 says in the 3rd year of Jehoiakim King Neb. sieged Jerusalem and Daniel was taken.(Daniel 1:6) History says 609 was Jehoiakim's first year to rule. History will also say Daniel was taken in 606. got my ifo. from Funk and Wagner Encyclopedia.

Doug Mason

Alwayshere,

Are you telling me that the 70 years ended when some of the Jews actually "left" Babylon (actually Chaldea)?

Or are you saying that it ended when all of them left (but that never happened)?

Or are you saying that it ended as soon as the Babylonian dynasty ended (when Cyrus took the city)?

Does Jer 29:10 say the 70 years ended when God "brought them back" or "when they started to rebuild the altar"? What does the WTS say?

Doug

Alwayshere

Jeremiah 29:10 In accord with the fullfilling of 70 years AT Babylon I shall turn my attention to you people, and I will establish toward you my good word in bringing you back to this place. Also Jeremiah 25:12 "And it must occur that when 70 years have been fullfilled I will call to account AGAINST THE KING OF BABYLON AND AGAINST THAT NATION."

Doug Mason

I want to know what the WTS says was the event that marked the end of the 70 years, which no one has specifically answered for me.

Jer 25:12 says God will call Babylon to account when the 70 years had ended ("have been fulfilled"). Jer 29:10 says God will turn his attention to bringing his people back after the 70 years had ended (fulfilled).

Jer 29 is Jeremiah's response to the false prophets in Jerusalem and in Babylon who were predicting swift release from their exile - see for example Jer 28. Jeremiah is telling them to hang in there and settle down because the previously proclaimed 70 years will continue to run its course.

Since the WTS holds to a different position, then the WTS is wrong. That's not my question.

I want to know whether the WTS marks the end of the 70 years with the moment that the Exiles returned or whether they relate it to the later event when the returnees met at the ruins of the temple altar in the seventh month.

Doug

White Dove

Every single time the WT or BS started discussing years and dates and prophesy, my eyes began to glaze over. The slowly moving hands on the clock got much more attention than the conductor did.

White Dove

You know, I just realized why I couldn't follow any of that. They kept changing it!

The WTS's endpoint of the "70 Years"?

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