The right law suit can dredge up this information. Discovery allows for broad inquiries even if tangenital to the initial claim.
Depositions, Requests for Production of Documents, Interrogatories .... you can really make them sweat.
Think the GB Knows much about WT's Financial Holdings? Think Again
by flipper 29 Replies latest jw friends
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metatron
The members of the Governing Body I knew, ate with and talked to are dead. That said, I did not think they were very bright or knowledgeable. Knorr was a competent businessman who was extremely negative and dictatorial otherwise. Fred Franz had a fantastic memory but no special administrative skills - the rest? well,............ Apart from Fred, the idea that these guys were Bible Scholars in any sense was absurd.
I actually continued as a faithful Witness because I thought the Organization was enormously successful in spite of the ignorant, biased men who ran it. This was Holy Spirit in action to me.
Later, I realized that an astounding amount of eager self deception is the real 'miracle' of Jehovah's Witnesses as an Organization. I would not be surprized in the least to think that these men don't know or understand the economics or legal issues of the organization they run. I strongly suggest anyone who hasn't done so already read Crisis of Conscience for a realistic view of these men and the banality of their secret deliberations.
metatron
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flipper
Good replies ! I'll reply to those on page 1 first who I haven't replied to. Been working a lot lately !
BLACK SHEEP- Possibly a few mwmbers of the GB might know some about the financial holdings true, but they probably don't know EVERYTHING they need to know. I think the WT corporate attorneys and financial powers above the GB know and are aware of more.
PAT 1060- That is an interesting angle on the persecution . Keeping the GB and legal separate. Interesting.
THE ORACLE- I do hope it crumbles soon, believe me. I think it's entirely possible that WT attorneys or financial powermongers controlling the WT society could in time run off with the $$$$ and commit extortion. All it would take is one or two bad apples to get greedy and they could wreck a lot of havoc from the inside.
GERARD- Good point. If the U.S. government would allow full public disclosure of the WT society's financial holdings it would be a good thing.
LUO BOU TO- It would be interesting to see who would get the money if the WT society crumbled . I'm willing to bet it's someone we don't expect or are aware of.
DIAMONDDIZ- I don't think the educated WT attorneys are " brain dead " - they just don't believe the doctrines that the WT society teaches and that's how they can compartmentalize what they do in looking after the financial interests of the WT society. I feel the WT attorneys are just as much for scamming and making money off rank and file members as the GB is. And whoever else is at the top of the organization. They know what scam they are pulling.
CAMEO_D- Thanks for the link. Interesting.
CANTLEAVE- It's hard to say whether the U.S. government will insist the WT society discloses everything publicly or not. I'm sure the government gets annoyed with tax exempt status of religions so maybe big brother will come down on churches after all ? Time will tell.
DOZY- I agree- the GB has very little understanding of complex financial matters. You would think with all the scandals and frauds as you say that the government would crack down on religions more. I hope we see it in our lifetime.
OTWO- Exactly. Businessmen and powerful financial entities will definitely want a piece of the WT society pie before they go down slowly. I'd be interested to know where the $$$$ is going from the sales of property in Bethel . Is all of it being used to re-invest in upstate rural New York ? Too bad the WT society won't reveal that information to rank and file members. I'm sure they don't want them to know.
TJLIRBE- You make some very good and valid points. Lack of contributions, lawsuits, and general malaise financially of members has brought the WT society to the breaking point. I don't think the powers controlling the finances reveal much to the governing body because I really think there might be a power struggle going on at the very top of the organization. When big $$$$ come into play men at the top do bizarre things.
DISSED- That is amazing about the wealthy family you knew who became a legal support team for Bethel- closing deals on JW estates and willed properties to the WT society. It is a " vulture syndrome " for sure inside the walls of the WT society and it becomes apparent when you see them each fall print articles in the Watchtower of how rank and file members can donate inheritances, trusts, homes, life insurance policies , etc. To me it's immoral and disgusting for the WT society to request or even mention it. Many children of older JW members will be losing out on inheritances. Sick
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flipper
JONATHAN DOUGH- Good point. The right lawsuit can dredge up this information. I'm sure that Bethel legal is dealing with lawsuits as we speak.
METATRON- I agree with you. I don't think members of the GB have been the sharpest tools in the shed either. It would be so easy for highly placed financial powers that control the WT society's assets to disembowel them for all they are worth. If it gets to a desperate point and greed is possessing a WT corporate lawyer or two - there is no telling what wool might be pulled over the governing bodies eyes. The future is going to get very interesting I believe
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ldrnomo
I'm sure the GB are privy to the basic financial standing of the organization
Yes the three basic's:
Are we losing money? (meaning, Oh s**t we're fu**ed. We gotta start squezzing more money outta our benevolent brothers and sisters. Hey maybe we can do a series of WT mags on the joy of giving. They may even come up with new light on what would be an appropriate amount to donate perhaps suggesting 1/10 as a good scriptural standard. They might also include articles showing, (with true life examples), The many REWARDS one can recieve by giving all they can. I recall giving a talk about cheerful giving. THAT REMINDS ME OF A STORY
That talk outline was one of the ones I had. I gave the talk at another congregation and afterword the PO of the congregation told me he didn't think the example I used was an appropriate one. Look below for the example I used.
Are we breaking even? (meaning, "oh well, we're eating good living good, I guess we just can't buy any extras")
Are we making money? (meaning "Maybel, have the girls pack our bags, we're going to be doing some world traveling)
Example:
I thought all the children that were featured in magazine articles who gave their lives were the ultimate givers. They gave their lives after all. So I highlighted one of them, a young girl who needed blood transfusions to live, she died and gave the ultimate gift HER LIFE....
LD
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GLTirebiter
Looking at the WT organization as the corporation that it is, the GB can land in very hot water if they don't know about the financial dealings. They are the ones who sign the documents, and they must answer to the IRS etc. if the organization does something a not-for-profit religous corporation isn't allowed to do. Even though their attorneys prepare the deals, the directors (GB) are ultimately responsible for them.
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Mad Sweeney
The GB aren't the corporate directors anymore, GL. Corporate leaders and religious leaders have been legally insulated from one another since earlier this century (was it 2002? someone correct me here). Thus, the reason this topic is of interest.
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flipper
LDRNOMO- Interesting points you bring out. Perhaps that elders conscience was pricking him about the children " sacrificing " their lives by dying by not receiving blood transfusions. Your bringing it out in an honest way as an example caused him to be somewhat made " to feel guilty " about the WT policy perhaps. But hey - it needed to be brought out. If it seems strange that the WT society asks children to sacrifice their lives by refusing blood transfusions- it's because it IS STRANGE ! Not only that - it's reprehensible and immoral that the WT society lets children experience that - and then honor them for doing it. Sick.
GL TIREBITER- Good point you make. Exactly. The GB is too trusting of the WT corporate attorneys that they are ALL PURE and are after the same thing the GB is after - control of people and proliferation of the WT society. I think the fact the WT GB trusts the corporate attorneys way too much is going to come back and bite them in the a$$ some day. I hope I'm right.
MAD SWEENEY- So because the GB is not the corporate leader of the WT society anymore - I feel it puts them in a precarious position for being taken advantage of by the WT corporate attorneys in time. It will be interesting to see if a " Judas syndrome " develops among top WT attorneys getting greedy for big $$$$$
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DaCheech
they have stockholders/board members that are not the "gybbering body"
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flipper
DACHEECH- Exactly. The stockholders/board members are NOT on the governing body. True- So the big question is - Who REALLY has the power ? Peace out, Mr. Flipper