by leavingwt 61 Replies latest jw friends
Its not a word game, it really isn't and I don't want to make it seem that way.
Its just that wanting is one thing, being able to is another.
Dude, I've spent most of my life believing just that,
It's probably no doubt the reason why I WANT to believe it.
After leaving the "organization" I read as much forbidden stuff as I could get my hands on. I wondered if I might lose my belief in God altogether, as many here have.
It finally came down to whether or not I believed Jesus was a real person, died & resurrected. If he wasn't, then pooey on it all. After researching both secular and scriptural sources, I concluded he had, indeed, been born, died & was resurrected. I needed some evidence to have faith. Jesus himself performed miracles to give evidence of who he was. He didn't say "Hey, Im the Messiah cause I said so." he backed up his words with tangable evidence. I see nothing wrong with asking to see some evidence.
Where I may differ from other Christians, is that I focus on Jesus & his sayings as the "Word of God", not necessarily the whole new testament, because I believe the apostles & their associates did their best to write down what happened to the best of their recollection, but they were people just like us who make mistakes.
It kind of bugs me that some say a person was never a christian to begin with , if they left. Reminds me of the jws who were shocked after 22 years that I would ever leave, then have them say " She was never one of us" I don't claim to understand it all, thats just my humble opinion.
I could be wrong, but it wouldn't be the first time.
It kind of bugs me that some say a person was never a christian to begin with , if they left. Reminds me of the jws who were shocked after 22 years that I would ever leave, then have them say " She was never one of us" I don't claim to understand it all, thats just my humble opinion.
Thank you Littlebird.
It really is quite rude and belittling of the others intelligence to assume that their faith was never "genuine"
Wow.
Just, wow!
littlebird, you're spot on - whether someone "was ever a Christian" is not our call to make - to do so is to put yourself in God's place and try to deny His grace to others.
sphere - the door's always open, keep journeying as you feel led and you'll get there - wherever 'there' is!
LWT
I'm sorry. Somehow I missed a few posts.
It would be helpful to me, if you could briefly explain what made you a Christian. Will you please?
The short answer is God, but, I know that's not what you want to hear. As I've said in the past, simply believing Jesus and God exist, is not the characteristic of Christian or saving faith.
I believe I'm a sinner deserving hell. I believe Christ has done everything nessesary to save me from that. The life I now live, I live for Christ. The problems of this life, don't really matter to me in the end, they are God's problems, for Him to work out.
Sphere
You've made the huge assumption that the JW's is the only christianity I have known.
OK, I'm sorry, I misunderstood or misread this: "it's sad that the JW's ruined christianity for you" as an admission of that fact, but it doesn't change a thing. You make the "huge assumption" that you know how I feel. The truth is you know very little about what I believe or how I feel.
When you say, "I want to believe". Do you (or did you), want to believe you are a sinner, deserving of hell?
It really is quite rude and belittling of the others intelligence to assume that their faith was never "genuine"
It's easy for you to say this when you refuse tell anyone what you do or did believe. It's also "quite rude and belittling" for you to assume you know enough about me, to tell us you understand my faith, when I doubt you know what it's about. Much of my family and many of my friends don't even (or want to) understand. It's not about how genuinly you believe. It's what and/or who you believe in.
Deputy,
Thank you for that additional information.
The short answer is God, but, I know that's not what you want to hear.
Please give me a little more credit. I'm listening to your personal testimony and accepting it. I don't feel that I could question another person's testimony, even if I don't understand it, etc.
-LWT
LWT
Please give me a little more credit. I'm listening to your personal testimony and accepting it.
I'm sorry, I know and thank you. In Sphere's defense I know it's hard to be brief and concise sometimes in matters of faith.
Don't get me wrong, I understand the objections to my views about "choice". I hear it all the time from both sides, believers and nonbelievers. I simply don't believe anyone can resist Gods grace, and I expect that to be offensive to the human spirit.
It really is quite rude and belittling of the others intelligence to assume that their faith was never "genuine"
It's easy for you to say this when you refuse tell anyone what you do or did believe.
Sorry, still dont' feel the need to spill my guts, on demand. How about you take a few hours, and go into detail about what you believe and how it came about, type it all out for me, post it here.
Then the rest of us will decide if your faith is genuine or not, .......is that what your sugesting I do?
The truth is you know very little about what I believe or how I feel.
The truth is, I know pretty much nothing about you, other then you claim to be a christian, and you don't appear to be the warm fuzzy kind.
You made a statement about how you feel about your faith, I stated that I have felt the same way, I was agreeing with you.
Dear aSphereisnotaCircle
Sorry, still dont' feel the need to spill my guts, on demand. How about you take a few hours, and go into detail about what you believe and how it came about, type it all out for me, post it here.
No one asked you write a book or spill your guts on demand. I was hoping maybe you would tell (in a few seconds) us about a few of the churches you put your faith in.
Then the rest of us will decide if your faith is genuine or not, .......is that what your sugesting I do?
I'm not hear to challange your dedication to what you believed, I'm sure you were very dedicated. My point was and is, you could be the most dedicated JW, Mormon, Catholic, Baptist... that ever lived and not be a Christian.
The truth is, I know pretty much nothing about you, other then you claim to be a christian, and you don't appear to be the warm fuzzy kind.
I guess you were expecting Joel Osteen?
You made a statement about how you feel about your faith, I stated that I have felt the same way, I was agreeing with you.
I made a statement about what I believe (that a Christian, by definition, can't stop being a Christian), NOT how I feel.
No you weren't agreeing with me. You were attempting to belittle me, by bragging about how great your faith was, and I quote:
DD your faith could not possibly be greater then mine was.
The faith you had in what ever it was in, was great I'm sure. But what ever that was, it wasn't in my God, and it sure wasn't able to keep you for all ete
We humans tend to ponder the mystical aspects of life and for some they expect an epiphany to cement their expectation. And its all rather subjective isn't it. John Wesley who started the Methodist movement wrote frankly about not feeling any particular feeling about Faith, he just set about doing good for the poor.
Yesterday in the rain I fixed an older lady's hot water heater, she asked if I had 'come to know Him', 'sure', 'Him' it was cute. Like the Jewish Christian James wrote- take care of widows and orphans, if you need an epiphany go watch the sun rise and set, that should do it.
