Pedophiles Among Us - (H20 post) (page 4)

STRUGGLE

To Thinker's Wife

I am glad that I clarified that for you. I promise I will try to stop
beating myself to death.

Love and kisses to you all.

Edited by - Struggle on 31 December 2000 22:24:4

Xandit

I hope this gentleman's letter makes it into the media because I believe this is a pot that needs to be stirred.

Having said that. There is something of a misrepresentation in what he is saying, at least currently. In all cases of alleged abuse, regardless of the number of witnesses even if there is only one, the matter is supposed to be reported immediately to Legal at Patterson. In all cases the congregation is directed to comply fully with state law on the matter and as far as I know in all 50 states that means it has to be reported to the relevant authorities, even if it is an unproved allegation and there is only the one witness, Legal even provides the right phone numbers and they want action taken in 24 hours. The accused party is not part of the discussion and does not have to be investigated before this action is taken, the allegation is enough.

I know that it hasn't always been this way but that's the way it is now.

In addition, this idea of people being charged with slander because of reporting to the legal authorities is baseless. There are no such instructions and I certainly don't know of it being done. I don't believe the definition of slander used in the organization would support such a charge.

The Organization is very, very cautious about getting into legal problems on this issue and they are doing everything possible to make sure there is compliance with the Law. You may question their motives but that's the current state of play. I've had direct experience with this and feel confident in the statements I am making.

waiting

Hey Xandit,

this idea of people being charged with slander because of reporting to the legal authorities is baseless. - xandit

Would you please post the original information supporting your statement? This is not the situation to which this "gentleman" (who I would assume is still a brother, even though no longer an elder by choice) refers to. He is referrring to enforced silence within the congregation - not outside the congregation.

If my children were to accuse a pedophile of molestation, all he would have to do is deny it and as a father I would be silenced with the threat of disfellowshiping if I were to try to say something (slander of a perceived innocent man) in a way of warning to protect others who may be in harms way. I state for the third time, this is wrong it is unethical and immoral to not protect children

In the event the pedophile denies the charge he/she is protected by church authorities. The church then demands the victim remain silent or face shunning for slander of an innocent man. I feel I can trust no one within the Watchtower organization with my children. As it stands now, if my child were to accuse a Jehovah’s Witness of molestation, all he/she would have to do is deny it, and as a father I would be silenced with the threat of shunning if I were to try to warn or protect others who might be in harms way.

I can vouch for this enforced silence of the victims and their families. I've posted my information previously, but the congregation my daughter told this information to refused to even call the Kokomo elders and warn them that they might have a potential child rapist among them and might want to look around. The Kokomo, Indiana elders did not even question the man, for fear of slander suit threatened by this man. The rapist was never investigated nor questioned and remained a brother in good standing until his death many years later.

I was the one who called the congregation PO to tell him of my daughter's charges. He told me that this man's daughter had just written them a scathing letter outlining years of incest at her father's bed. I reported him to the police. I wrote the WTBTS. I was the one who was visited by the CO and PO. The CO talked with me, and suggested strongly that I remain silent "for the good of the congregation." I argued I didn't have to - the $%^# molested my daughter and nothing was done. Not even a finger lifted by either congregation. Finally, he counseled me that since the rapes were not proven, if I persisted in speaking of such things, I could be in line for charges of slander. I got the point. Furious, I shut up for 10 years.

You say things have changed within the WTBTS. It's about time.

waiting

Edited by - waiting on 1 January 2001 0:49:25

Frenchy

STRUGGLE

"The sacrifices to God are a broken spirit;A heart broken and crushed, O God, you will not despise." Ps 51:17 NWT.
There is a verse in a song I heard the other day that goes like this: "The only difference between a sinner and a saint is that one is forgiven and the other one ain't."
What is the difference between a sinner and a saint? A repentant attitude. Feel remorse for wrongs done, cease and desist the wrong course, ask God for forgiveness and then allow him to do his job. Don't beat yourself. Remember that God EXPECTS us to sin. If we were to be condemned for merely committing a sin then Jesus died for nothing. The reason for his sacrifice was for redemption of sins. Yours and mine. Don't deny him that function, it's what he died for.

-Seen it all, done it all, can't remember most of it-

STRUGGLE

Dear French

Well put. Words can't express how much that meant to me. Thank you so much.

Xandit

Waiting,

His statement is not exclusionary it is general. That being the case, reporting these matters to the legal authorities should be sufficient until they have reached a decision. At that point assuming they find the accused guilty then reporting that fact to members of the congregation would certainly not be slander. Speaking to members of the congregation who are not involved investigatively or judicially before there is some resolution does not seem like a good idea. As someone pointed out, and I have seen this happen, these accusations are not always correct. In that case character assassination is what's happening, less serious than molestation perhaps but equally capable of ruining someone's whole life. If that sequence is followed, report to authorities on accusation and then speak to people once the authorities have resolved the matter, then there is no protection of the guilty party by any 'code of silence.'

I very much regret your personal experience, what happened was wrong. I am much relieved that anything like that today is at least supposed to be handled differently. I would like to see this man's letter published just to continue the process of educating people in the organization.

mommy

Waiting,
I am sorry for what you and your daughter have endured.
mommy

Frenchy

You're welcome, STRUGGLE.
And thank you, Seven, for the vote of confidence.

Edited by - Frenchy on 1 January 2001 18:11:57

OrangeVale Bob

I had a discussion with my bro the attorney once concerning slander (nope, he didn't follow my well intentioned advice to quit college and become a jdub). His understanding was that a statement had to be knowingly false with the intent to do damageto be slanderous. Slander is difficult to prove.
Anyone know how the society defines it? Any attorneys out there to offer a clearer legal def.?
Not trying to change the subject, but it seems that this has been used a lot to keep people quiet.

Frenchy

Xandit:
The problem as I see it is not so much an official policy of ‘hiding’ pedophiles. You are quite correct that procedure dictates that the Society (in the USA I can’t say what the procedure is for other countries) be immediately informed of any such cases. The reason for this has to do with the legalities of specific states and nothing more. The cases are handled like any other Judicial case. And while I do not believe that an accusation alone (be it by adult or child) should be the grounds for condemning a person I do believe a different procedure is in order here.
I think the problem has to do with the indoctrination of the publishers in the idea that all problems should be handled within the congregation. This, I believe, is fundamentally the problem with the situation. The parents are reluctant to go to the authorities without the blessing of the elders. The elders are for the most part unqualified to deal with such problems and will have a tendency to treat it just like a case of lying or fraud, or immorality. They have been conditioned to believe that they are qualified to handle any problem because they have God’s Word (as explained by the WTS, of course.) They are directed to 2 Tim. 3:16, and told that they are qualified to handle any situation and that God’s Word makes them ‘fully competent’ and ‘completely equipped for every good work’. They will look for tears and promises of doing better in the future, pat the evildoer on the back and let him go. In this case it just doesn’t work. I believe the publishers should be told that if and when this happens that they are to take this child to a qualified professional. Let the professional advise the parents as to whether they should notify the authorities. They should be instructed to follow the recommendations of that medical professional. In actuality the opposite happens because the Society engenders distrust in medical professionals while portraying itself as the very Word of God and in total control of the flock with God’s smile of approval.
A sad fact of the matter is that a number elders are quite unwilling to share their authority even with the secular authorities. They have actually been convinced that they can invoke the Holy Spirit with a prayer before the meeting and that it will guide them unerringly.

-Seen it all, done it all, can't remember most of it-

Pedophiles Among Us - (H20 post)

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