DISHONEST debates and discussions are everywhere!

by Terry 24 Replies latest jw friends

  • Terry
    Terry

    People don't listen when you talk to them. Ever notice that?

    The silence while you are speaking isn't listening. The other guy is just waiting for his turn.

    Take Perry, as an example. He jumps in with both feet and starts a debate. But, he doesn't read what you post. He overlooks your answers. He characterizes you in unflattering language and moves on to the next post. He's everywhere but he's never really IN A DISCUSSION.

    All over the Discussion Groups there are identical arguments going on with NOBODY LISTENING and EVERYBODY TALKING.

    Hit and Run debate is a big pastime in the world.

    The most popular radio shows are commentators spewing anger, criticism, polemic poison. People listen!

    If a caller calls in with a contrary point of view the host lashes out, bullies them, controls the "conversation" and cuts them off. Then, a one-sided harangue continues with the caller unable to respond!

    Can any of this be good for us?

    The best use of a Discussion Board is to HEAR what others are thinking and to expose ourselves to OTHER ideas.

    If we only agree with what we ALREADY BELIEVE we never grow.

    Remember, we are all guilty of our own narrow thinking. We all do it. We try to drown out dissent because being wrong really hurts.

    But we must be vigilant. Else we become what we hate in others: adamant ideology disguised as thinking.

    You have to be willing to wrong to be honest.

    You have to be willing to listen and think BEFORE you respond.

    Without this, the discussion boards are just puppet shows; a Punch and Judy pastiche of time-worn cliche's.

    Keep discussion alive, thinking open, dialogue honest, ego tucked away and readiness to admit error in the forefront.

    Otherwise, we are all wasting our time.

  • minimus
    minimus

    Simply stated: very true!

    Of course, a person may simply have a viewpoint that will not be changed. Still, he is free to express his feelings on the discussion board.

  • TD
    TD

    The cardinal rule has always been that you must know the position you disagree with so well that you could argue it yourself. (An advantage that some xJW's usually have over active JW's)

    "There is a lot of debate on the net. Unfortunately, much of it is of very low quality. The aim of this document is to explain the basics of logical reasoning, and hopefully improve the overall quality of debate."

    http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/mathew/logic.html

  • PSacramento
    PSacramento

    Actually, the best discusion are when people "voice" their views and NEITHER party tries to "convert" the other.

    It keeps things civil and allows 3rd party "listeners" to decide for themselves.

  • Terry
    Terry

    The rush of being a Jehovah's Witness when you are first inducted into the Borg comes from the seemingly endless stream of NEW AND FRESH IDEAS!

    The constant challenging of your perspective to take in thoughts you've never had before about the world, the flesh and the devil is exhilarating.

    Your world view goes from zero to sixty in a kaleidoscopic whirlwind of change, modification and adaptation of thought.

    Then, it begins to slow. Ever slower. Ever sloooooower.

    Finally the day arrives; you are sitting in the Kingdom Hall glancing at your watch repeatedly thinking about what you need to be doing at home!

    You realize all the ideas you are hearing are as stale as last months moldy bread.

    You feel like you want to scream as you listen to the obvious being stated with such a "sense of discovery!"

    THE IDEAS are gone and IDEOLOGY and programming have replaced them.

    This is what happens before the final slide into depression and claustrophobia with Watchtower thinking!

    I still love wonderful IDEAS. It is hard to bump into really good ones anymore.

  • ziddina
    ziddina

    "The rush of being a Jehovah's Witness when you are first inducted into the Borg comes from the seemingly endless stream of NEW AND FRESH IDEAS!... The constant challenging of your perspective to take in thoughts you've never had before about the world, the flesh and the devil is exhilarating..."

    Uhhh, NO , it wasn't.... It was being dragged to boring meetings as a small child, having Halloween taken away from me [oh, and also Christmas, come to think of it...], being forced to become a shunned outsider at school [which prepared me very nicely for leaving the cult later on!], realizing that the bible was a bunch of superstitious, ignorant Middle-Eastern hooey made up by pompous, self-important peasant sheepherders ["God's CHOSEN people!?? Yeah, right...], and being bombarded by some of the most insane, crazy-making idiocy that even I, as a child, could see through...

    Then there were the beatings...

    Getting OUT was exhilarating, however... Zid

  • Terry
    Terry
    Uhhh, NO, it wasn't.... It was being dragged to boring meetings as a small child, having Halloween taken away from me [oh, and also Christmas, come to think of it...], being forced to become a shunned outsider at school

    Ahhh, you were born into the darkness whilst I was a convert! That is the most horrible fate, indeed!

  • Mall Cop
    Mall Cop

    TD,thanks for the link. It will keep be busy for a while.

    Terry, Thanks for all of your topics and post responses. Those are the kind of discussions that make me think and re think and have helped me to reconsider what I believed in the past when I was not a freethinker.

    Blueblades

  • Mall Cop
    Mall Cop

    BTW. I found a shirt that I wear. It say:"THINK, IT'S NOT ILLEGAL YET

    Blueblades

  • ziddina
    ziddina

    "Ahhh, you were born into the darkness whilst I was a convert! That is the most horrible fate, indeed!"

    Weeelllll, not exactly... Parents joined when I was 5 years old; by that time I'd developed an active - a VERY active - interest in rocks... When the brother read Exodus 19: 16-19 from the podium [I was 7 - 8 years old at the time...] I immediately sat up and exclaimed, "That's a VOLCANO! They're describing a VOLCANO! An ERUPTING volcano!"

    After that, I didn't really believe in either the WTBTS, the JWs, or the bible. If that so-called "god" and his followers were so totally CLUELESS as to how the earth really worked, then "he" must not really exist...

    Besides, it was REALLY STUPID to draw all the tribes to the base of an erupting volcano... Yet more evidence that there was no bible "god"... And where's a pyroclastic flow when you REALLY need it???

    So, even tho I mouthed the words and shammed the walk, I really never was a JW. The beatings, unfortunately, left me in such an intimidated state, however, that I didn't leave until my early '30's... I will never forgive those superstitious idiots for robbing me of half my life... Zid

    BTW, idiot parents and kid brother are still fully brainwashed...

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