"When armageddon happens, I want to be able to SEE the people dying"

by jambon1 52 Replies latest jw friends

  • BabaYaga
    BabaYaga

    Guest with Questions said:

    Psalm 137 was written by man to God, not the other way around.

    BINGO!!!

    And heartfelt congratulations to you and yours, Jambon!

  • ziddina
    ziddina

    The Oracle, that talk you heard, "you recognize a lot of your neighbors, and a lot of people that slammed the door in your face while out in the service, and then you come across another face that seems very familiar! Oh my, it's brother so-and-so! Then you look in to his contorted dead face, and shake your head and say - too bad for brother so-and-so! I guess he missed too many meetings! Too bad he wanted to stay home and watch the football game instead of coming to the meeting. Boy, am I ever glad I went to all the meetings...."

    Yeah, I heard that one many times when I was a kid... Always made me feel rebellious; if this Jah-head was so damm snitty that he wouldn't allow a person to skip a few meetings - sheeesh!!! Besides, that whole "Jehovah so loved the world that he gave up his only-begotten Son..." But he's gonna "KILL 'em all at Armageddon if they don't do what WE say!!!" Yeah, that really impressed me with "gawd's" luv...

    Guest With Questions, You - like so many other white people - have NO clue about what YOUR OWN ancestors went through!! And largely as a result of that Greco-Romanized Middle-Eastern religion, Christianity, by the way... Christianity spread across Europe largely at the point of a ROMAN sword!!

    The Romans held the British Isles under their sway for around 400 years, from 43 A.D. to 409 A.D. http://stoswaldfoundation.blogspot.com/2009/08/chronological-map-of-orthodox.html [How do you think "Hadrian's Wall" was built? Do you think the Romans lowered themselves to such menial, manual labor??] That's far longer than the United States of America allowed slavery to remain legal - around 100 years. [1775 - 1865] At this point, I'm not counting the years that various European powers had active colonies in America with accompanying practices of slavery... The system of "indentured servants" was basically a form of slavery. As my buddies in the SCA joke, "What's a Norseman's name for an Irishman [or Irish woman] ?? 'Slave'!!" The "Slavic" countries in central Europe are so named because they were regularly raided for white slaves by the Romans - and quite possibly by the Greeks before them.

    I'd love to write a book about the REAL story of slavery - starting way back around the 4,000 B.C. time period... It would be VERY DIFFERENT from the popular perception of slavery held by most people - black and white...

    Whoops. Off-topic. Anyway, I remember all those ridiculous comments about "I want that house after Armageddon!" comments - some made directly to the home owner. No wonder some JWs received rude responses while going door-to-door... Zid

  • Yizuman
    Yizuman
    I honestly don't give a rats arse who it is refering to here. Smashing babies heads against a rock is just hideous.
    Can't see how any human can see it any other way.

    Neither do Jesus. When the writer wrote about babies being smashed against the rocks, it was written from the heart of man, not from the heart of God. Man wrote this down in anger and in anquish from the memories after witnessing what they had done, because at the time, in 586 B.C., the Babylonian Soliders murdered many Jewish babies because they did not want them to grow up to avenge the deaths of their parents. When the writer wrote verse 9 of Psalms 137, he was writing the words from his own heart, not from the heart of God.

    You need to learn to read between the lines, rightly dividing the word of Truth. Many words written by man speaking of eye for an eye, tooth for tooth and words of killing, revenge and so on were from the heart of man, the anger and anquish of what they have witnessed with their own eyes and crying out for Revenge.

    Now after reading Between the words, words that come from the heart of God comes something like this......

    "Vengence is mine, I shall repay" - God is telling man, I will bring Justice to those who murdered your children, because God knows the heart of man and how they will react and especially, "OVERREACT" such as blind revenge, rage that blinds the reasoning center of the brain and the killing to avenge the deaths of their children by killing Babylon's children. God doesn't want them to end up regretting what they had done when they come down from the seething rage and reasoning returns to their minds and realize what they had done was wrong. Throughout history, even today, all too often man strikes back man for whatever has wronged them and often it's done out of pure rage and anger. Can you think straight when you are enraged??

    So when God brings justice, he brings what a sound Judge should do, with of sound of mind and logic, not influenced by emotion such as anger, He will bring TRUE justice against those who commited a crime against innocent little children. That includes those that murdered little children out of anger and revenge because theirs was also murdered. Two wrongs don't make a right.

    Philip said to him, "Lord, show us the Father, and we will be satisfied."

    Jesus: Have I been with you all this time, Philip, and you still do not know me? Whoever has seen me has
    seen the Father. How can you say, ‘Show us the Father’? Do you not believe that I am in the Father
    and the Father is in me? The words that I say to you I do not speak on my own; but the Father who
    dwells in me does his works. Believe me that I am in the Father and the Father is in me; but if you
    do not, then believe me because of the works themselves. Very truly, I tell you, the one who
    believes in me will also do the works that I do and, in fact, will do greater works than these, because I am going to the Father.

    Jesus came to show us the heart of the Father, the heart that does not support the revenge killing of children simply because their children was killed.

    And this is what Jesus said...

    Matthew 5:38 -41 "You have heard that it was said, 'Eye for eye, and tooth for tooth. But I tell you, Do not resist an evil person. If someone strikes you on the right cheek, turn to him the other also. And if someone wants to sue you and take your tunic, let him have your cloak as well. If someone forces you to go one mile, go with him two miles."

    Note Jesus said, "You have heard" Jesus never said "God said that it was eye for eye", that shows that God never supported that supposition to act on vengence, but rather the opposite. Who ever wrote that wrote from the heart of man and not from the heart of God and Jesus showed just that from his own lips and action, "Whoever has seen me has seen the Father"

    Know what's harder? Forgiving the actions of the wrongs that was done against you. It's easier to fall into anger and take matters into your own hands than to forgive.

    So remember, read between the lines and know the difference between what is written from the heart of man and what is written from the heart of God."

    Yiz

  • cameo-d
    cameo-d

    SuperPunk: The first type of 'prayers' were actually curses. People called upon deities for revenge. Even today, not much has changed.

    Snowbird: I never heard about that. It's horrible, yes. But to be able to justify doing something so ghastly and feel vindicated is beyond my comprehension.

    Threads like this just take my breath.

    The fact that you all were exposed to this attitude and trained to adopt those thoughts---looking back on your own involvement must be a real nightmare. The remorse you feel for allowing yourself to be immersed in that evil for even a short time....remorse is what true repentence is all about. You all are the Overcomers. You have too much love in your hearts to be taken down and consumed by the evil.

    We can come here and debate doctine till the cows come home. But at the end of the day, it is our actions toward others in real life that changes them. Even if you cannot find any love in your heart for your oppressers, to at least be able to find forgiveness through pity, or come to a point of indifference toward them, is better than any revenge that will bloody your own hands.

    I can't help but wonder about these people who want to see people die just so they can feel vindicated to prove the point that "we were right. God loves us better than you." It must come from a real selfish ego and a need for power and superiority. And even if a tragedy strikes and they see their own "righteous" die...it still doesn't hit home because they just pass it off with "Well, he'll be back soon."

    I think the only way to bring them to their senses is by unconditional acts of love toward them regardless of the way they treat us.

  • Yizuman
    Yizuman

    I see someone beat me to it...

    Psalm 137 was written by man to God, not the other way around.

    Pretty much the same thing as I was trying to say in my previous post

    Yiz

  • jambon1
    jambon1

    So when god directed the Israelites to purge the land of the cananites, that is different is it?

    Did he direct them to do so or not?

    Has god made bears kill children or not?

    Did david get away with murder or not?

    Did god destroy the Babylonians by his hand & direction or not?

    Seems to be a bit confusuion with what some read in the bible to what others read?

    Or are you just rationalising to justify your beliefs?

    Genuine questions.

    J

  • Yizuman
    Yizuman

    Jambon,

    Can you read between the lines and know when words are written from man to God and what's written from God to man?

    It's tough seeing the difference.

    Here's a suggestion, that I offer to everyone new to Christianity, read the NT first before they begin to read the OT. Because if they do the OT, they're not going to understand the mind of God unless they read the NT first. I specifically tell them to read the book of John first, after that Romans. Then go back from the beginning in the NT and read it all the way to Revelations. Then go ahead and read the OT starting from Genesis all the way to the last book of the OT.

    That helps alot for people to really understand and know the difference what words are the heart of God and what words are the heart of man.

    Yiz

  • Guest with Questions
    Guest with Questions

    Ziddina: I have no personal knowledge of what happened to my ancestors. I'm sure there are horror stories that many could share if they could speak. Black slavery is more recent and the effects are still with us. I know that slavery has always been with us. It's still with us - Child labour and the sex trade to name just two.

    Do you consider Christianity a form of slavery?

    Here's an interesting quote from one individual:

    ‘Let me summarize my views on what modern evolutionary biology tells us loud and clear … There are no gods, no purposes, no goal-directed forces of any kind. There is no life after death. When I die, I am absolutely certain that I am going to be dead. That’s the end for me. There is no ultimate foundation for ethics, no ultimate meaning to life, and no free will for humans, either.’ Provine, W.B., Origins Research16(1), p.9, 1994.

    One definition of slavery: a condition of subjection or submission characterized by lack of freedom of action or of will.

  • beksbks
    beksbks

    Bleah! Another example of assuming anyone not part of the club is "evil".

    Common of most religions.

  • cofty
    cofty

    Defining who is INSIDE and who is OUTSIDE the club is what religion is most concerned with. It is a misapplication of an instinct that otherwise served our ancestors well. Now it finds unpleasant expression in churches and football stadia

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