mindmelda, "it's the only way you can cook the math to get 1914." My mom just texted me and said that even people who are not jws know that something significant happened in 1914 so 1914 supports bible prophecies.
So my mom called me an apostate today
by doublelife 44 Replies latest members private
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doublelife
I have a question. If I ask my mom to get me a king list from the society's publications, she'll tell me that I need to do the research myself and get it. So how do I get her to do it?
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AnnOMaly
I have a question. If I ask my mom to get me a king list from the society's publications, she'll tell me that I need to do the research myself and get it. So how do I get her to do it?
I suggest you become her partner in research. Go to the WTS publications, show her their kings' lengths of reign and say you still get 587. Get her to baby you through (although you'll be babying her through as well). Make her the teacher, the one that has to persuade you. Ask her 'dumb' Columbo style (non-threatening/'I don't understand') questions on things that don't fit - e.g. 'How can 20 years just disappear from their calendar like that?'. She'll probably quickly sense the discrepancies and their implications and either shut down, giving the 'just believe' line (journey ends), or she'll follow through with you and start to wake up.
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crapola
Hey DoubleLife, if I did'nt know better I would think you had been talking to my mom. She says the same thing to me. My Dad died a few years ago and she to has said what a shame it will be when he is ressurected and I'm not there. I really hate those kind of guilt trips. Plus it does'nt work. It just makes me more determined to live my life the way I want to now. I finally had to tell her that we should'nt discuss it anymore because it would only lead to hard feelings. I'm like you in the sense that I hate hurting her but I also have to live my life.
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thetrueone
This article explains why the WTS pushed this wrong chronological doctrine out to the public.
http://corior.blogspot.com/2006/02/refutation-of-appendix-in-let-your.html
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fluke
Half the 'battle' is knowledge...
And thankfully, you know that the guilt thing is a weapon...
Be strong indeed... x
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Black Sheep
I have a question. If I ask my mom to get me a king list from the society's publications, she'll tell me that I need to do the research myself and get it. So how do I get her to do it?
Ask for her help.
If you suspect she doesn't have the litterature she needs, you have a problem, but if she has a WTCD, encourage her to help you prove 607, using the lengths of the reigns of the kings.
Try to get her to do it as a list of years from 625 to 539, or the other way around, showing which king reigned in which year. You could even make it easy by providing her with a written up list of years to 'help' her. Something like:
539 Year 17 Nabonidus
538 Year 16
537 Year 15
536
535
etc. to get her started.
Once she has the idea, don't tell her anything except how to go about using the search function of the WTCD.
Everything else that she tries to throw into the picture is a distraction and you should act offended that she is using that tactic. You asked for a list. One that you can use if a potential convert at the door asks you to do the same.
One of the problems with trying to tell a JW something is that the only time they ever hear what you are trying to say is when you say something wrong. e.g. archaeologists have no way of telling what year Jerusalem fell. They don't have the technology to date artifacts from that era with an accuracy of twenty years, let alone one year. They get their dates from historians, the same as you and I do. To get around this problem, just ask questions. Then it doesn't matter if your memory is off. Just ask the questions that lead them to uncomfortable answers.... and don't let them change the subject.... and their favorite trick is to swamp you with a whole truck load of blurb on a slightly related subject without actually answering your question. If they try that... don't even let them finish the sentence before informing them that you know that trick and that you are offended that they are trying it on you.
If a JW makes a statement that you know is untrue, immediately ask them to prove it.
Remember:
If you only ask questions, you don't have to prove anything.
If they make statements they have to prove them.
You do not have to answer their question, especially if they already owe you an answer.
Never finish a conversation without them owing you an answer.
.... and most importantly, remember ..... you are the aggrieved party. You didn't ask to be brought up in a religion that uses psychological blackmail to force compliance to faulty beliefs on you. That was her choice, and she has to live with the consequences.
Good luck
Chris
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Black Sheep
If she hasn't got the required litteratrash, just write up your own list, quoting EVERY article you can find on the WTCD that supports you. Do not quote other sources. That way, you cannot be accused of researching outside the WT, but she can be if she does.
Give her your list saying that this was the best you could do with the reigns you got from the Watchtower. Ask her to show you where you made a mistake and give her a written up list of years 625 - 539 to do her version on.
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Black Sheep
Summary of Babylonian kings reigning over Jerusalem
Calendar Year Nabonidus:
17 yrsLabashi-Marduk:
< 9 monthsNeriglissar:
4 yrsEvil-Merodach
2 yrsNebuchadnezzar II
43 yrs539 BCE 17 540 16 541 15 542 14 543 13 544 12 545 11 546 10 547 9 548 8 549 7 550 6 551 5 552 4 553 3 554 2 555 1 556 0 (accession year) less than 9 months 4 557 3 558 2 559 1 560 0 (accession year) 2 561 1 562 0 (accession year) 43 563 42 564 41 565 40 566 39 567 38 568 37 569 36 570 35 571 34 572 33 573 32 574 31 575 30 576 29 577 28 578 27 579 26 580 25 581 24 582 23 583 22 584 21 585 20 586 19 587 18 * 588 17 589 16 590 15 591 14 592 13 592 12 594 11 595 10 596 9 597 8 598 7 599 6 600 5 601 4 602 3 603 2 604 1 605 BCE 0 (accession year -
jwfacts
I'd let her know that it is disappointing that she went to do some research about what archaeologists and came back with that site. It is a very poorly written article by someone (most likely a JW) that wants to believe in the 607 date and simply rehashes Watchtower information. For example it says:
"Promoters of the 587-B.C.E. theory argue that what the Bible says about the rule of JehoiAkim disproves 607-B.C.E."
587 is not a theory, it is an archaeological fact. The theory arises from religious attempts to interpret what the 70 years in the Bible refer to. Rather than have her go through what people with a religious agenda have to say, ask her to look simply at information from people without anything to gain, such as the Encyclopedia Britannica.
I'd recommend not getting into doctrinal debates. If she has some questions it is ok to answer them, but not if she just wants to argue or preach to you about Watchtower doctrine that you already know.
What she wants to believe is that there is a chance for you, her and your father all to meet again in paradise. What you could simply say is that you do not believe God is so unloving as to kill billions of people that have never heard of the Watchtower Society.