My dear brother in JAH, Matrixx... thank you... and the greatest of love and peace to you!
YOUR servant... always... sister... always... and fellow slave of Christ... ALWAYS...
Shel
Me, the WT, and the "Separating Work"...
by AGuest 122 Replies latest jw friends
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palmtree67
Shelby,
Thank you so much for posting this story. I was also wondering about your visit to Bethel, but I thought it might be rude of me to ask. I have always wondered what the reception would be like if one of the "other sheep" pointed out an incorrect teaching. I think you did what you did in a very respectful manner.
Thank you again,
palmtree
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Think About It
Before you went to Bethel did THE VOICE say, "go the distance?"
Think About It
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wobble
Thanks for posting the story dear Shelby, and thanks for posting here often ,usually as your Lord tells you to. So not your choice, or wanting to "show off", just what you are told to bring to us, we are privileged.
I value your contribution to the board, plus your evident sense of humour and your kindness even to those who attack you.
I always thought that Jaheshua had all the qualities you display, from my reading of scripture, not least the sense of humour ! So different from the WT God, he never laughs !
Please keep posting, and keep us informed.
Much love,
Wobble
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tec
AGuest - I'm not really sure what to think about your posts, yet. I'm also new here, and I've found some of them to sound completely *off the wall* and others to sound *right on!* I find myself reading them out of sheer curiosity! And at the very least, you've reminded me to keep an open mind and not to judge :)
Thanks, Tammy.
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OnTheWayOut
7 causes of Hearing voices
- Falling asleep - some people hear their name called.
- Psychiatric disorders - Hearing voices
- Psychological disorders - Hearing voices
- Psychosis
- Psychotic depression
- Schizophrenia
- hallucinations
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Think About It
OnTheWayOut.......you forgot to mention the 8th cause for hearing voices.
- Working in a corn field
Think About It
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moshe
Thank you Aguest for your story- yes, the WT has made veiled disclaimers about the literature before, but the brothers just don't get it. Your realization about the blood is spot on- using your chart is just plagarizing you- no credit for it was there? Like my topic about the F&DS - it seems that no GB member has publicly said he is a member of the F&DS class- and no JW has ever bothered to ask a GB member in person that question, either.
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AGuest
Dearest PalmTree, Wobble, Tec, and Moshe... the greatest of love and peace to you... and thank you for your kind words.
And not rude at all, dear Palm. I have nothing to hide so I don't mind questions, even about my personal life (so long as it's not about my loved one's "business" - they don't deserve to have their all-n-all out there simply because I am. It must be their own choice). But, since you've shown interest, here is what happened with the trip to Bethel:
It was spring of 1997 (I think - it might have been 1996...). By this time, the Master had really been telling me things. Unfortunately, big mouth that I am, I didn't keep it all to myself. If someone asked, I had to tell them the truth... just as I heard my Lord say it to me... even it if wasn't what the WT stated. One of those issues was the fact that Judas was indeed at the evening meal (he had to be - the "covenant" was made with all 12 tribes, not just 11. Had Judas left, there would have only been 11 tribes taken into the covenant. That Judas was present... but UNCLEAN... is the reason my Lord DIPPED morsel he gave him. The others' morsels were undipped... thus, clean). And so, when people asked me if Judas "really was there," I had to say, yes, he was. You can imagine, some of the boys didn't really like that!.
Anyway, word was beginning to spread. Quiety, at first. But there were "rumors" in New York. I knew this because of what occurred when we arrived. HOW we got to New York, though, is a story unto itself. As I stated before, my Lord had me write, well, a kind of "report" showing how when WE die... we simply pay for our sins - we don't buy BACK life for ourselves. This was an important issue because the WT teaching that when one dies one pays for one's sins... and so should expect a resurrection... totally negates the PURPOSE of my Lord's sacrifice. Meaning, if OUR death ENTITLES us to life... what the heck do we need HIM for? Why don't we all just pull a Jim Jones... and then wait to be resurrected to life?
The TRUTH, though, is that our lives... our blood... isn't worth anything. Not one thing. The wage of sin is death. So... when you die... you pay the wage. However, the GIFT... GOD gives (and such IS a gift)... is everlasting life by JAHESHUA MISCHAJAH. There is NOTHING we can do earn it... nothing we can do to be worthy of it... nothing we can do to deserve it... nothing we can do to get it... except eat from the Tree OF Life. It is a gift... and so those that DO get do so due to God's mercy... and nothing else. It is due to UNdeserved kindness... not how many years one has "served"... or how many hours one has put in field service... not how many years one has been married to the same person... not how many ones has gone without committing adultery, extortion, theft, drunkenness, homosexuality, etc. Nothing. It is a gift.
And so, as I stated, I wrote about this to the WTBTS... but received no reply. And so, one morning, my Lord woke me up and told me to "go to Bethel and say to the men there, 'Hear what the Most Holy One of Israel has said..." and I was supposed to remind them of these truths. BUT... I didn't have a dime. Seriously. Nothing. Nada. We had just paid the mortgage and household bills, and all I had left I needed to buy groceries. I wasn't working so our income was really touchy.
Anyway, another Body Member came to visit me and I told her what I'd heard. And she said, "Well, then, I'll go with you." I told her that I didn't even know HOW I was going to go, but that I had to... and within the week. Now, you all know how much a round-trip plane ticket costs with less than a week's booking, right? Well, I shared what I needed to do with her on Saturday and she said, "You know the Father will provide, so just pack. We'll worry about how we'll get there... and where we'll stay later." And so, she went home and I packed.
The next morning, she came over with a Sunday paper and said, "Our way to New York is in the Travel Section." And I said, "Really? Where?" But she didn't know. She said the Spirit had told her to get the paper and that our "way" would be in the Travel Section. And so we each took a piece of that part of the paper and began to look. But... we couldn't find anything. Not a thing. And we really started to get concerned, because she believed what I told her our Lord had told me... and I believed what she said he had told her. But we couldn't find anything. Until... she turned to the Travel column of the CLASSIFIED... and there was a TINY little add that said, "Round-Trip, NY, $108."
Seriously. I am NOT lying. Now, of course, while we knew the price to be fantastic, we thought, yeah, but we probably have to travel next month, or during blackout times, or something like that. But... we stepped out on faith... and called the agency listed in the ad. Guess what the deal was? We had to book THAT day, Sunday... and travel AND return... by the next Saturday!! Seriously. I am NOT lying. That day, we booked TWO round-trip tickets from Sacramento to La Guardia Airport... leaving Wednesday (she needed to ask for time off)... and returning Friday. The ONLY reason we returned Friday is, again, I had no money. And she could only afford ONE night in a hotel (she paid for the airline tickets, too!).
But what about the other night? What were we going to do about that? And my Lord answered. He told me that we would be able to stay with a JW couple that I had been closed to but had moved to Brooklyn a few years before. Since I hadn't seen or spoken to them in close to 8 years, I was a little skeptical. BUT... I trust him, so I called and asked if we could stay with them for a night. And they said, "Come on out!" So, for less than $300... the sister and I went to Brooklyn, New York... and to Bethel.
When we arrived the couple picked us up. Because it was late, however, and they had to go to work/out in service the next morning, we only chatted for an hour or two before going to bed. The sister and I spent another half hour or so trying to plan our transportation, because, again, we didn't have very much money. We even planned to eat only one meal each day to preserve what we did have. We didn't know if we should take a cab to Bethel... or take the subway (two actually, each way) and then walk (and it would be quite a walk... both there and back). That question was answered when we got up the next morning: the couple had left home... BUT... they had left us a small pile of subway tokens... enough to get to Bethel AND back... AND to Penn Station, were we could get a car to New Jersey! So, once again, transportation was taken care of.
When we arrived at WT headquarters... well, actually, just before we arrived, we passed quite a few buildings that were apparently owned by the WTBTS. A couple were pretty sky high... and one was huge (the one they recently sold that comes with a car if you buy a condo in it). A couple things struck us: first, most of them were empty. Second, several of them were rented to "worldy" people (we found THAT really interesting... we thought Bethelites didn't "mix" with the world. We were wrong.) The MOST eerie thing, though, was that from the subway exit... to the front door of Headquarters... we saw one JW. One. And we walked close to 10-12 blocks. ONE JW.
[If you've ever been to Bethel, you will notice it is situated down in a kind of cul-de-sac with a small park directly across the street from the entrance. The street used to go through but when we asked we were told that the WTBTS had had the outlet blocked for some years. So, when you go down into the area, you kind of get the feeling that THEY can see YOU coming... because YOU can see THEM. Couple that with the fact that there was NO ONE on the street BUT us... well, I am sure they knew they had visitors.]
So, we go in. And, yep, there was that huge globe, right inside the doorway. When you enter, you must go up a short set of stairs... like entering into one of those old-fashioned banks or corporate foyers. To your left is a smallish sitting area. Sort of like a living-room/lounge. Directly in front of you is, well, the reception desk. I would call it more like the reception counter - it was long... like the registration counter at a hotel. There were two young men sitting behind it... with one computer between them. Neither looked up as we entered. In fact, neither looked up until we were all but leaning on the counter... leaning over it, actually.
To the right were three separate and HUGE "reception" areas. We were told on the "tour" (yes, we had a tour - I'll get to THAT in a second) that these areas were designed for the busloads of JWs that come to tour Bethel. Yep, sometimes 3 busloads at a time. And sometimes 3 or more times per day. While waiting for their tour to begin, folks could view the looping video on several monitors around the area. There are also little packets of WTBTS "postcards" (you know, the "We made it to Bethel and You Didn't - Don't You Wish You Were Here?"... although, no, they didn't actually say that... kind). Note, it was in one of these areas (the second one back), that we met with Mr. Barber... and viewed the video.
So, we get there and we're asking the youngsters at the desk about... well, about... nothing. I mean, again, if you've been to Bethel, you know what I mean. There is nothing there. Nothing. The lobby was COMPLETELY empty, save the globe, the counter, the guys behind the counter, the little sitting area, the receptions areas... and the postcards. There are bathrooms around the wall behind the counter, and we visited that. Typical WTBTS KH kinds of decorations. So, we didn't know what to ask about.
(One thing we did note was that there was a young man "dusting" the counter... and a young lady "vacuuming" the carpet in the area behind the counter and outside the restroom. We noted this because the counter was dusted from front to back... and the little carpet area vacuumed... the ENTIRE time we were there. They were going over the SAME spots when we arrived... and still there when we left close to 5 hours later!).
Moving on...
Then one of the young men then told us that if we had come on a SATURDAY... when most of the visitors come... we COULD have gotten a tour. BUT... since it was Thursday... there were no tours. Shoot! Now what? Well, we stood there... trying to keep our faith. We HAD been sent... but who were we supposed to talk with? HOW were we supposed to talk with them because there was nothing that indicated we would even run into a GB member, let alone actually meet and talk with one.
While we stood there (watching that same young man dust that same corner of the counter), a young couple and young man came out of a door and went and stood in the living room/lounge area where they chatted. And then... the young man broke away from the couple, and came toward us. He said, "Shelby!? Is that you?" It was the couple we were staying with's son!! He "worked" at Bethel and was walking some friends out. He had NO idea I was in town, let alone at Bethel (he hadn't talked with his parents)... and seemed glad... and slightly confused... all at one time. "What are you DOING here?!" he asked. Thankfully, we hugged at just that moment and so I didn't have to answer!! We chatted a bit and then it happened: he asked us... if we wanted to join him for lunch in the DINING ROOM!!! Seriously. Seriously! But it gets better: he then asked if we wanted a TOUR... BEFORE lunch! WHOO-HOOO... and praise JAH!!
Of course, we said, "Oh, sure, that is if you don't mind and really have the time." And so off we went!
Now here is where the "Charlie and the Chocolate Factory" part of my story comes in... because it really was kind of like that. We went down a LOT of dark corridors... and peeped through a LOT of windows. BUT... virtually EVERY door was locked (my friend had to use a key to "in" every single door, even if it led to a stairwell!) We passed by offices, and art rooms, and editing rooms, etc. I say "passed by" as the ONLY room we actually went into was the former "Legal Department."
Now, I put "Legal Department" in quotes because... well, it was virtually empty. The shelves were empty. The offices were empty. The desks were bare. The only "things" present were a few shelves of very old law books (and I do mean old)... and a few display cases that had books with some the WT "famous" law cases laid open. And that was it. Nothing else. No-thing. When we asked about it, my friend said that the Legal Department had moved to Patterson and he and couple others were the only ones left in Brooklyn... but they would be following soon. (It was because he worked in the Legal Department that we got to go behind that door!)
Well, by now it's lunch time... so off we go. And lunch... well, let's just say Bethel lunch is a major event. At least, it was then. First, we enter a large dining room with many tables, each seating about, say, 12. And EACH table was piled high with food... even if no one sat there!! I kid you not... there was enough food to feed each of the twelve apostles... AFTER they had fasted 40 days!!... on EACH table. EVEN if no one sat at the table.
So, my friend, the sister, and I sat down at an empty table. And the table filled up quite fast. With... "brothers." African American "brothers." And, yes, pun intended. Why? Because from the time they sat down until our attention was directed away (I will explain that in a second)... they HIT ON US! I kid you NOT! Right there... in front of God... and the GB! Well, the GB hadn't arrived yet, but it didn't seem like these "bruthas" cared when they did! And get this: not only did the sister and I both have on wedding rings... but SO DID THE BRUTHAS!! The sister was openly offended - I mean, she "handled" them... but you could tell she didn't like that she had to, one bit! I was too nervous to say anything to them... because I waiting to see who it was I was going to have to talk to. For all I knew... it was the entire GB.
At some point a murmur started going around and so the sister asked our tour guide friend what was going on. And he said a GB member (Schroeder) had just arrived. We couldn't see him (he was across the room) but you could feel the underlying "excitement"... no, reverence... in the room (I mean, folks all but went "We're not worthy..." and begun waving palm branches). Just then, another murmur arose behind us, but not quite as... well, "exciting" and this time it was Carey Barber. He got a little "ooohhh-ahhhhh" but then was shuffled past us so fast we no opportunity to speak to him.
Shortly after that an announcement was made and all talking immediately ceased. Then everyone stood up and a hush fell over the room as Schroeder said a prayer. Now, for the LIFE of me I can't remember the prayer. BUT... I DO remember thinking, "THIS is how they pray at Bethel???" It was one of the most "empty" prayers I'd ever heard. The sister looked at me... and I looked at her... both our eyes wide open and eyebrows raised... so we both knew "something" wasn't "right"... at least, as far as our expectations of what went on at Bethel with regard to such things go.
Anyway, we spent an hour passing bowls of food back and forth, but not eating because we were both nervous... and fending off the "bruthas" (man, those guys thought they were the stuff!!).
And then... Carey Barber, having finished his lunch... was coming back our way. And my dear sister, reached out and gently grabbing his sleeve, greeted him. Now, this sister was and is gorgeous... and so "dear" Mr. Barber stopped... and began grinning from ear to ear. I then took over fending off the "bruthas" so that my sister could speak with Mr. Barber (and my friend was trying SO hard to hear what she was saying to him, he was almost falling out of his chair (as I said, apparently rumors had already reached Bethel because of some of the "strange" questions the young man asked during the "tour" and now how he was almost killing himself to hear what my sister was saying to Mr. Barber. But we couldn't hear because she had kind of tugged Barber's sleeve so that he had to bend down to hear her). After some point we all heard him sputter and splutter and then say, "Why, yes, of course. Why don't you come to my office after lunch?"
WHOOOO-HOOOO!!!
Well, it didn't quite happen that way. Once lunch was over, our guide had to get back to "work" so he said he needed to hurry and escorted us back to the lobby. The empty, lifeless lobby. The one with NO people. Now what? How were we going to get to Mr. Barber's office? And then, he came out.
The first thing he said was, "I'm not sure meeting in my office is a good idea - they're, uh, remodeling." Of course, he didn't know we had actually been on a semblance of "the tour" and see it... perfectly intact... with no sign of life... let alone remodeling work... in sight. Ah, well... here he was and we'd take him wherever he wanted to go.
He decided on the second reception area, as I said... and so we all walked over there and sat down.
I'm sorry, dear ones, but I really have to stop here as I have a 1.5 hour commute in the morning and am "suffering" from the time change. But I want to post this much now and will post the rest before the end of the day tomorrow.
In the meantime, may the undeserved kindness and mercy of my God and Father, the Most Holy One of Israel, and the love and peace of His Son and Christ, my Lord, the Holy One of Israel and Holy Spirit... and the One who sent me to Bethel... be upon you... if you so wish it.
YOUR servant, and a slave of Christ,
SA
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snowbird
*spellbound*
Sylvia