Hmm..Holly Spirit selected Ray Franz...WTF, I agree with Mad - they are testing the limits with such utterly ridiculous vomit. Poor JW drones..
Holy spirit reveals stuff through GB--July 15, 2010 WT
by sd-7 54 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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Stealth
It is all a bunch of Woo Woo!
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Rabbit
"It's utter hogwash. They might pray to their Jewish volcano god for guidance but it still boils down to a 2/3 majority vote of the members." ~Mad Sweeney
I've known about the '2/3 vote' thing for a while, but, does anyone have a scan proving that? I need it for a dub. I think it could be a closer.
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Ultimate Reality
All hail the Governing Body for their 'honestly explained adjustments'. Does it not warm our heart that Jesus saw fit to install these 'representatives' in 1919?
And it sounds like more blessings are going to be coming down the channel! Truly, the end is near!
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Mad Sweeney
I've known about the '2/3 vote' thing for a while, but, does anyone have a scan proving that? I need it for a dub. I think it could be a closer.
It comes from Crisis of Conscience, IIRC, so if the Dub you're working on doesn't trust Ray Franz it's not going to work on him. Give me a minute and I'll try to find it.
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Mad Sweeney
Here they are:
CoC chapter 11 (page 279?):
"The pattern held particularly true if any traditional policy or position was under discussion. One could know beforehand those members who would almost certainly vote in favor of maintaining that traditional policy and against any change therein. Even in the case of the “alternative service” issue, already discussed in a previous chapter, though here outnumbered, these members were still able to prevent a two-thirds majority vote from altering the position on that issue."
(page 286?)
"The evidence pointed instead to the conclusion that any open discussion of these difficulties was viewed as a great danger to the organization, as disloyal to its interests. Unity (actually uniformity) was apparently counted more important than truth. Questions about organizational teachings could be discussed within the inner circle of the Governing Body but nowhere else. No matter how heated the debate on an issue within that inner circle, the Body must present a face of unanimity toward all those on the outside, even though such “face” actually masked serious disagreement on the point in question.
I found nothing in the Scriptures to justify this pretense, for those Scriptures commended themselves as truthful by their very frankness, openness and candor in acknowledging the differences existing among early Christians, including apostles and elders. More importantly I found nothing in Scripture to justify the restricting of discussion to such a secretive, closed society of men, whose two-thirds majority decisions must then be accepted by all Christians as “revealed truth.” I did not believe that truth had anything to fear from open discussion, any reason to hide from careful scrutiny. Any teaching that had to be shielded from such investigation did not deserve to be upheld."
(page 332?)
That afternoon Chairman Schroeder brought the Governing Body’s decision to me. Evidently those seeking disfellowshiping had not attained a two-thirds majority, for he simply informed me that I was being asked to resign from the Body and also as a member of the headquarters staff.
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Terry
Did holy spirit at any point ever lead the apostles in Jerusalem to a false conclusion, which they then directed all other Christians to follow without question? If anyone can post a scripture here to support that, by all means do so
I asked the JW I talk to this very question when I brought up the new "generation" definition. I'm waiting on the research.
The Jerusalem group was still teaching Gentiles had to be circumcised and observe all the laws of Moses.
Paul, on the other hand, (by direct revelation) was teaching that Gentiles did NOT have to observe the laws of Moses.
Two different "understandings". The Holy Spirit was directing the Jerusalem congregation and Jesus himself was directing Paul.
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Leolaia
In addition to this, however, deep things were to be revealed during the time of the end. The very prophecy Daniel recorded was “sealed up” until that time. (Dan. 12:9)
The Society teaches that the Danielic "time of the end" is our day. If that is the case, then the book of Daniel shouldn't even be in the Bible. The putative author is told to "close up and seal the words of the scroll until the time of the end" (v. 4). This is not some hidden, secret understanding of the scroll to be revealed at a later date; this refers to the book itself. The scroll itself is closed up and sealed so that no one could even read the "words" of the scroll. So for the author, the "time of the end" was the time the scroll was finally opened and read by others. That was many centuries ago.
holy spirit helps responsible representatives of “the faithful and discreet slave” at world headquarters to discern deep truths that were not previously understood.
That's the most explicit I've seen from them in some time, specifying even a location. I think this again has the effect of telling the growing number of partakers that although the F&DS = the anointed, only the anointed in one particular location have the specific responsibility of "feeding the flock".
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Leolaia
I've known about the '2/3 vote' thing for a while, but, does anyone have a scan proving that? I need it for a dub. I think it could be a closer.
It's not mentioned anywhere in the official literatire, right? Would the dub accept CoC as a source?
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Mad Sweeney
Fred Franz explained about the Paul versus Jerusalem elders thing quite well in the 1975 Gilead Graduation speech opposing the concept of governing body. I think the transcript of that talk is on freeminds.