My daughter asked me this today. (page 2)

Soldier77

I'll take this back to the beginning of man's existence.

Why would God create beings with free will if he knew that introducing this free will could cause some to disobey him? So he create perfect Angels with free will (before humans), they disobey and rebel. Then he creates humans on that same model. But this time has experience and evidence that free will in lesser beings has a higher potential for failure.

Then sure enough, firest human pair fail at the free will test and leads us all to die. Isn't it a bit flawed? Maybe we're just an experiment, lab rats, or entertainment? Make beings just smart enough, just intelligent enough but can't live forever, limit what they can physically do and let's see what happens...

I just don't get it. If you are sovereign ruler and are omnipotent, omniscient then why not wipe the slate clean and start over. I mean, just wipe everything, Angels, universe... everything. Hey, you're supreme, you can do anything, so why not? This seems like a mind f**k experiment if you ask me.

JWoods

All religions attempt to answer unanswerable (by proof or logic) questions.

All of them eventually end up with different answers.

All of them are absolutely sure they are right.

brotherdan

Jwoods, that's why no PERSON can answer these questions. What we have is the Bible. That's it. If it's in the Bible, there is our answer. If not, we don't have an answer for now.

tec

Soldier - OR maybe God knows that the alternative/lack of free will would be worse for us - or pointless. Life is a gift. If we have free will, then that is also a gift. Otherwise, we're what? Automotons with limited free will, and a safety switch?

If you believe in a God of love, as Jesus showed Him to be, then you trust that he has a lot more knowledge and experience to draw upon than any of us could even conceive of.

Tammy

JWoods

Jwoods, that's why no PERSON can answer these questions. What we have is the Bible. That's it. If it's in the Bible, there is our answer. If not, we don't have an answer for now.

Many religions attempt to answer these questions without reference to the bible. Bible religions all end up with wildly different answers, all supposedly from the bible. They do not all even agree on what is in the bible. This is why I have become skeptical of human religions.

brotherdan

You're right Solider77, but your thinking of it in a human perspective. If God is all powerful, all knowing, all present, all wise, etc... The he cannot violate his own standards.

For example, God cannot lie. We say that God can do anything, but this is one thing that God cannot do. God also is love. He cannot violate that love. He cannot violate his justice or wisdom either.

So while to a human, it might seem like it could have been possible to destroy everything (angels, humans, universe, etc...) and then start over, this would never fit in with his qualities that he CANNOT violate. The way that he has handled it is the only for it to work.

Any of those that suffer will receive 100 fold for what they go through. Any of those that die, will receive their reward. In the long run (maybe not immediately) this is the best solution possible. Also it is the most loving. You have to look at it from a bigger picture. If I had to suffer to be with Jesus tomorrow, I'd eagerly suffer and do whatever necessary to be there with Him. Sorry if that sounds to "Holy Roller" for you. But it's how I feel.

LostGeneration

brotherdan,

i was where you were a year ago. I dumped the witnesses like a hot potato when I realized how far off track they were from the bible. It took about another three months, but then I dropped the bible once I realized how far off it was from rational thinking. See Numbers 31 if you have any further questions, the part where God kills all the non-virgin women and the young males makes a lot of sense.

Soldier77

Oh I'm not saying that we shouldn't have free will Tammy. To me that is part of what makes us intelligent creatures, it at least makes us unique.

I still believe in a supreme god, but I think one has to use that free will to accept him on your own terms and it becomes real to you personally. There are billions of people (I suspect) that have come to choose to believe and serve a supreme god. The JWs are sliding further and further into blasphemy however, their mind control takes away that free will from their members and instills programmed automated responses = automatons.

iPhone, iPad, iPod, iRobot, iJW.

Mad Sweeney

No offense taken, brotherdan.

It isn't the WTS that has turned me (and many others) into a religious skeptic. It is rational analysis of evidence. Evidence does not support the Bible as any more special or divine than the Tao Te Ching or any other number of "holy" books. Evidence does not support the claims that the Bible makes about its God.

For what it is worth, I still believe in a divinity but I don't believe he/it can be known in any way other than personal revelation. Books might help a little but they can't be trusted as the word of God. Faith can't be taught, it must be experienced. Is there such thing as a Christian agnostic? I think I might be one.

My daughter asked me this today.

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