Who really is Michael the Archangel? (page 12)

debator

Hi kurtbethel

Thats a bit of a fallacy picture. Since We are only talking alternate names/titles for one person/being aka Jesus in this case (of which there are many more in the bible... Logos, lamb, christ, Immanuel, Servant, Messenger, Lord etc) Trinity is saying 3 persons can be one being which is a tiotally different premise.

Hi MadJW you bring out some nice points.

I always feel like asking people that do not believe Michael is just an alternate name for Jesus. Who is Michael then?

Daniel 10:21
but first I will tell you what is written in the Book of Truth. (No one supports me against them except Michael, your prince.

Michael is our prince!

hmm isn't Jesus a prince?

Isaiah 9:6 "Prince of Peace."

Daniel 12:1
[ The End Times ] "At that time Michael, the great prince who protects your people, will arise. There will be a time of distress such as has not happened from the beginning of nations until then. But at that time your people—everyone whose name is found written in the book—will be delivered.

Does a prince become a king? He the one name as our protector "stands up" basically comes into power at the end times? So he becomes a Ruler from just being a prince so king then? taking power but wouldn't this put Jesus's nose out of Joint who is also given kingly ruling power at this time?

Jude 1:9
But even the archangel Michael, when he was disputing with the devil about the body of Moses, did not dare to bring a slanderous accusation against him, but said, "The Lord rebuke you!"

He is the only archangel in the Bible with specific named dealings with Satan.

Revelation 12:7
And there was war in heaven. Michael and his angels fought against the dragon, and the dragon and his angels fought back.

In the Great battle in heaven it is Michael and his Angels that fights Satan and his Angels casting them out of heaven. Wow! who is this michael?

When we are talking about voices and the resurrection.

John 5:25
I tell you the truth, a time is coming and has now come when the dead will hear the voice of the Son of God and those who hear will live.

1 Thessalonians 4:16
For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.

So which voice awakes the dead Jesus's or an Archangels? or logically they are both the same voice!

Black Sheep

I always feel like asking people that do not believe Michael is just an alternate name for Jesus. Who is Michael then?

That is the sort of loopy question my family tries to use all the time.

It is just an attempt at changing the subject to something that really is quite irrelevant to who Jesus is.

Why does it matter who Michael is?

Deputy Dog

MadJW

You mean the Dr Suess books you have a hard time reading?

So you're comparing WT literature to Dr Suess?

How can one answer a question that makes no sense?

You mean it makes "no sense" to YOU? Is that because you believe in the WT over what the bible says? Or are you refusing to answer, to protect the WT lie?

I'll try to make it easier for you. The WT has taught you that Jesus was JUST a man. What part of the MAN (Jesus) was in Heaven with the Father?

Jesus said: he (the MAN) "came down from heaven". This means a MAN (named Jesus) was in heaven.

Jesus did not say Michael (the Angel/Spirit) was the bread of life that came down. If a spirit came down, Jesus would be a Spirit/Human Hybred.

DD, it was God #2 that came down as Baby Jesus! heh

Don't even try to put words in my mouth. I only have one God and this thread isn't about Him. This thread is about the WT/New World Translation's "a god" #2 (John 1:1)

designs

Seems like Eastern and Western Christian theologians have been 'lying' ( metaphysical shooting from the hip ) for 1800 years............

Not that it matters more than a hill of beans, but they keep trying sweet lads that they are.

So we are now segwaying into kenosis theory.

Think About It

Don't even try to put words in my mouth. I only have one God and this thread isn't about Him

No my friend you do not have only one true God. Jesus had only one true God. You have 3 Gods and therefore by definition are a polytheist.

Think About It

Deputy Dog

Think About It

The only angel/human hybrids mentioned in the Bible are the Nephilim. Doubt Jesus looked anything like that.

I don't believe it either, but, that's what you get when you combine an angel and a man and that is the WT's problem.

Deputy Dog

Think About It

No my friend you do not have only one true God. Jesus had only one true God. You have 3 Gods and therefore by definition are a polythesis.

No I don't. But if you understand such a trinity? Please, explain it to me.

Think About It

I don't believe it either, but, that's what you get when you combine an angel and a man and that is the WT's problem.

Not a problem if Jesus left his divine position and became flesh as in a perfect man. As you indicate yourself Nephilim type characteristics is what you would get if Jesus were a "God man".

Think About It

designs

DD-

Technically the Wt. Society teaches that whatever happened in the Kenosis the transference was to a 100% human, they don't offer any explanation as to how but that is their teaching on the subject. They do not teach a Hybrid Archangel/human theory. Just for the record.

Just so we don't burn to many straw men.

isaacaustin

Debator said:

1 Thessalonians 4:16
For the Lord himself will come down from heaven, with a loud command, with the voice of the archangel and with the trumpet call of God, and the dead in Christ will rise first.

So which voice awakes the dead Jesus's or an Archangels? or logically they are both the same voice!

My reply: Again you show your lack of understanding. Besides the fact that Jesus descending with a voice of the archangel does not make him an archangel, or a trumpet....go read slowly Rev 19, paying attention to verses 16 and 17.

11

7 Then I saw the heavens opened, and there was a white horse; its rider was (called) "Faithful and True." He judges and wages war in righteousness.

12

His eyes were (like) a fiery flame, and on his head were many diadems. He had a name 8 inscribed that no one knows except himself.

13

He wore a cloak that had been dipped in 9 blood, and his name was called the Word of God.

14

The armies of heaven followed him, mounted on white horses and wearing clean white linen.

15

Out of his mouth came a sharp sword to strike the nations. He will rule them with an iron rod, and he himself will tread out in the wine press 10 the wine of the fury and wrath of God the almighty.

16

He has a name written on his cloak and on his thigh, "King of kings and Lord of lords." Got Jesus

17

11 Then I saw an angel standing on the sun. He cried out (in) a loud voice to all the birds flying high overhead, "Come here. Gather for God's great feast, Ahh and the archangel!

18

to eat the flesh of kings, the flesh of military officers, and the flesh of warriors, the flesh of horses and of their riders, and the flesh of all, free and slave, small and great."

19

Then I saw the beast and the kings of the earth and their armies gathered to fight against the one riding the horse and against his army.

Who really is Michael the Archangel?

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