Just popping in, hoping NVL is doing okay. Still, feel free to call if you need people to vent to.
Definitely getting DF'ed now
by notverylikely 150 Replies latest jw friends
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wasblind
Jehovah Witnesses will tell you in a heart beat that, only Jehovah can read the heart.
Well Jehovah can also gage a persons spirituality, not her, I know we women tend to
use different excuses for not rendering the husband his due, but to say he's not spiritual
enough takes the cake.
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tec
Yes, of course, Wasblind. Its ridiculous. Perhaps an affair is what she wanted to incite? Someone mentioned that she had been relieved? In which case, though NVL is responsible for himself and his actions, she is also responsible for creating the environment for that situation.
Tammy
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wasblind
Hi tammy,
do you think he could have been set up ?
could she have taken this" not enough spirituality" route on the advice of some elder ?
that would be sad.
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wasblind
I'm tellin' anyone who's willin' to read my post
the WTS is Satan himself, and he's tryin' to use
this woman to cause damage to her family just like
he fooled Eve in the garden. These are the same people
who cause division by tellin' spouses to do Bible studies in private.
and who get the worst of this division? the children.
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Pistoff
Look, AGuest, my advice to NVL is IF he wants to avoid df'ing. One CANNOT tell elders the truth about what one's opinions are; they will punish you severely. The WT lies first of course: they say that you will only be disfellowshipped for attitude. Not true, of course.
If he wants to admit to adultery, that may not get him df'd, but even then NO third party should be invited into a marriage, unless it is a therapist or if all fails, attorneys. Elders do NOT belong in any discussion of fidelity; they are intruders.
My point is that elders do not reward truth telling, and unless he wants to leave the marriage, he SHOULD NOT DISCUSS his beliefs other than to assert that the WT is Jehovah's channel of communication on earth.
The elders regard sexual matters as important, but if they think you are apostate, you will be treated like toxic nuclear waste.
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Deceived
I just read this thread now, I don't know you well but I have met you a few times over on the "game" and I can see you are a normal healthy nice man and very likeable. You have a good friend in our Poopsie. I know Hot Chocolate and her advice is very good, she is a wonderful lady and an example of someone who survived something like you are going through.
IMO I think honesty is the best thing for you NVL, Life is to short to live a lie and pretend to believe. Your wife should be your closest friend, your soul mate, how can you be that with her if you don't agree with each other and she witholds her affection and sex from you. I am so sad about the children being in the middle of this. ((((((((((NVL))))))))))
Myself I was the one that was the woman in the marriage and the JW, my poor non believer husband had to put up with me and my JW crap. I withheld certain types of sex, he cheated on me. Told me why, begged me to give him better sex. I stayed on with the religion and we were drifting apart. I loved him and my 4 little children to much in the end to continue with the religion. I decided my family was more important and having a husband who loved me and so I faded.
I still believed I was going to die at Armageddon though and felt guilty but I decided I had to live my life on reality and not a religion and faith. Later I found out the truth thankfully. Thats my story. At least you know its not the truth so that is a positive thing.
Hugs from Velvet aka Deceived
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ziddina
WasBlind said: "do you think he could have been set up ?
could she have taken this" not enough spirituality" route on the advice of some elder ?
that would be sad..."
Actually, I think that might be legally actionable...
Zid
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AGuest
to defend some of those that said to lie - at least to the elders; let's not forget that we've been lied to our entire time as JWs - for some of us that means our entire lives.
And so acting in the same way is justified, yes? Sorry, dear UC (peace to you!), but I have to disagree. It makes you as deceitful as they are, perhaps even more. Because you certainly know what you're doing. Some of them... really don't. Hard to believe, but true.
I have no reservations about lying to the leaders and their appointed lackeys of this cult, if it will save me from some hardship that results from their sanctions against me. If I were in NVL's shoes, but really really wanted to keep my family intact, and if lying to a group of elders would get them off my back, I'd do it in a heartbeat.
Why would you even worry about their sanctions? Why even give them that power? To keep your family "intact"? How can you do that if you've now painted your wife to be a liar? You're not only lying TO them... but ON her. How, pray tell, is the MARRIAGE to survive that, let alone the family??
I'll play their little game...and I'll play it better'n them.
Then, you'll be better then them at their game, which makes you "better" than them? Seriously?
Look, AGuest, my advice to NVL is IF he wants to avoid df'ing.
Yes, I see, dear PO'd (peace to you, as well!): change your truth, lie on your wife, falsely accuse her of falsely accusing you... so that you're not df'd. Ummm... who is NVL supposed to be impressing here? Wife... or elders?
One CANNOT tell elders the truth about what one's opinions are; they will punish you severely.
No, they won't. They'll merely disfellowship you. There is nothing "severe" about being disfellowshipped. They simply make a announcement. No public flogging. No tar and feathering. No dragging through the streets. No pulling out of tongues or disemboweling. No stretching on the rack, gallows, or burning at the stake.
It is how folks treat you FOR being disfellowshipped that can be severe. And if such folks deign to treat you such, then they're not worthy OF you.
But I'm thinkin' (woman that I am) that the treatment he'll receive from his wife after he uses her as a scapegoat WILL be severe. Even more than how the others treat him. Think he just didn't get none for 6 months? Dear one, you have NO idea...
If he wants to admit to adultery, that may not get him df'd, but even then NO third party should be invited into a marriage, unless it is a therapist or if all fails, attorneys. Elders do NOT belong in any discussion of fidelity; they are intruders.
One, I ABSOLUTELY agree that he doesn't have to tell the ELDERS a doggone thing. I believe I said that. However (two), if he DOES choose to tell them (though, for the life of me I cannot fathom why), you believe telling them that his wife is a liar is BETTER than him telling them the truth? Seriously? Dear NVL... this is poor... VERY poor... marital advice. Which I am sure you already know.
My point is that elders do not reward truth telling, and unless he wants to leave the marriage, he SHOULD NOT DISCUSS his beliefs other than to assert that the WT is Jehovah's channel of communication on earth.
I am not sure we're reading dear NVL the same way, dear PO'd. My impression is that while he's not absolutely sure about continuing with the wife, he is absolutely certain about not continuing with the WTBTS. As dear Tec asked, am I missing something?
The elders regard sexual matters as important, but if they think you are apostate, you will be treated like toxic nuclear waste.
And, given his position regarding and understanding of them... NVL should care what they think of him because why?
Dear ones, I am assuming that since dear NVL has commented lately, he's dealing with his life. I believe I am going to back out of his business now and let him do that... unless he asks for more. Otherwise, I can only wish him... and his household... peace. In the way that my Lord, the Holy One of Israel and Holy Spirit, JAHESHUA MISCHAJAH, the Son and Christ of the Most Holy One of Israel, JAH of Armies, gives it.
Peace to you all, as well!
A slave of Christ,
SA
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notverylikely
Thanks for all the feedback. She's talking to the elders tonight, I am moving out on Saturday. C'est la vie. Basically she said there was no trust left (me smoking, cigars, other shit over the years, her hating drinking at all, me loving a few drinks, the apostacy, the adultery) and nothing to build on. Now I just need to decide if I bother to meet with the elders.