Demons and the WTS (page 11)

The Oracle

When I was having my awakening I went through an interesting period of time where I actually was quite worried about the demons, even though my brain was telling me the odds of demons being real was less than 1/10th of 1% or some other incredibly small number. You see, I was hitting apostate websites, checking out worldly encyclopedias, science journals and all those resources we were told to stay away from as they were a product of Satan and his demons.

Even though the logical side of my brain had concluded that the demons could not possibly be real - there were isolated instances where my emotions took over and I was a little freaked out about it.

I finally had to do something drastic to cure my fear and remove any doubt about their non-existance....

Thankfully now, I could go to the most acclaimed demon infested haunted house / graveyard / basement etc etc in complete darkness and enjoy a peaceful night's rest with absolutely no fear of the demons coming to get me.

Now I truly understand the real meaning of the expression the truth will set you free.

Ironically it has absolutely nothing to do with "the truth" according to the JWs - or Christianity for that matter.

I find that ironic, and it kind of makes me giggle.

Peace. Life is good.

The Oracle

xchange

Evidently Apostate

i was around 13 and my brother was 9 we stayed in this house that one of my mothers friends was a caretaker. this was a huge house in newport ri on a road filled with mansions from the 1800's. The place was called ivy towers and my mom and her friend left us and her daughter there, mind you we have never spent any time at this place. it was full of rooms with really old pictures and gothic paintings really erie stuff. anyway in the evening this girl and i are upstairs playing a board game in her room when i hear my brother running up the stairs yelling " jehovah, jehovah save me" he runs into the room crying visably shaken and proceeds to tell me when he went down stairs to use the bathroom you walk by this old picture of an elderly woman at the first stair. he explains that as he walked by he watched this picture and the woman in it was staring at him and no matter where he moved her eyes followed him. he also said it had a blue aura around it. being the big brother i had to check it out and although there was no blue light the eyes did follow you they seemed to move from left to right, however the portrait was encased in convex glass which gave that moving eye look. my point is although i have never had a feeling that demons were out to get me( i enjoyed playing capture in graveyards) my jw mother would parrot any foolish story to us kids that she was told , possessed smurf dolls, flying ouija boards, etc. it terrified my poor brother and i think maybe that can shape our perception of the supernatural.

Chalam

Welcome xchange and Evidently Apostate!

"jehovah, jehovah save me"

No JW calls on the correct name, for any type of salvation :(

Mark 16:17 (New International Version)

17 And these signs will accompany those who believe: In my name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues

Acts 4:10-12 (New International Version)

10 then know this, you and all the people of Israel: It is by the name of Jesus Christ of Nazareth, whom you crucified but whom God raised from the dead, that this man stands before you healed. 11 He is
" 'the stone you builders rejected,
which has become the capstone.' 12 Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to men by which we must be saved."

Blessings,

Stephen

brotherdan

Stephen, I'd like to ask you about tongues. I know that you believe that they are manifestations of the holy spirit. But there are a few qualms I have about it in modern times.

As far as I can see, in the bible, the gifts were only used by the jews. The gentiles were never spoken of as using them. Also, I NEVER see interpretations of the tongues that are used in various churches. It appears to be a manic frenzy of people running around, dancing, and yelling out gibberish. Paul said that if there was no interpreter then the one speaking in tongues should remain silent.

How do you feel about this?

NiceDream

Good question BrotherDan, my friend talked to me about that recently. She feels that speaking in tongues needs an interpreter like it says in the Bible. No one speaks in tongues at her church, and you don't need to speak in tongues to show you have the Holy Spirit or anything.

brotherdan

Totally my same opinion, NiceDream. Do I think people that believe in speaking in tongues are "less saved" than anyone else? No. But I just can't see the use for it today. I see the use for it back in the apostles time. But I feel that tongues as well as prophecy (or revelation) ceased after the apostles time. I think we have enough proof of holy spirit and Gods full revelation and there is no need for more of it today.

Chalam

How do you feel about this?

The Holy Spirit is for all who believe, Jew and Gentile alike Luke 11:11-13, Acts 2:38-39, Acts 10:45 as are the gifts of the Spirit 1 Corinthians 12 , 1 Corinthians 14

There is no division

Galatians 3:26-29 (New International Version)

Sons of God

26 You are all sons of God through faith in Christ Jesus, 27 for all of you who were baptized into Christ have clothed yourselves with Christ. 28 There is neither Jew nor Greek, slave nor free, male nor female, for you are all one in Christ Jesus. 29 If you belong to Christ, then you are Abraham's seed, and heirs according to the promise.

Ephesians 2:11-22 (New International Version)

One in Christ

11 Therefore, remember that formerly you who are Gentiles by birth and called "uncircumcised" by those who call themselves "the circumcision" (that done in the body by the hands of men)— 12 remember that at that time you were separate from Christ, excluded from citizenship in Israel and foreigners to the covenants of the promise, without hope and without God in the world. 13 But now in Christ Jesus you who once were far away have been brought near through the blood of Christ.

14 For he himself is our peace, who has made the two one and has destroyed the barrier, the dividing wall of hostility, 15 by abolishing in his flesh the law with its commandments and regulations. His purpose was to create in himself one new man out of the two, thus making peace, 16 and in this one body to reconcile both of them to God through the cross, by which he put to death their hostility. 17 He came and preached peace to you who were far away and peace to those who were near. 18 For through him we both have access to the Father by one Spirit.

19 Consequently, you are no longer foreigners and aliens, but fellow citizens with God's people and members of God's household, 20 built on the foundation of the apostles and prophets, with Christ Jesus himself as the chief cornerstone. 21 In him the whole building is joined together and rises to become a holy temple in the Lord. 22 And in him you too are being built together to become a dwelling in which God lives by his Spirit.

Maybe need a new thread or PMs?

Blessings,

Stephen

Watchtowers Witnesses

17 And these signs will accompany those who believe: In my name they will drive out demons; they will speak in new tongues.....

Chalam, I noticed you left out the next verse.

Mark 16:18 They shall take up serpents; and if they drink any deadly thing, it shall not hurt them; they shall lay hands on the sick, and they shall recover.

How strong is your faith? Do you think you could drink Drano and it wouldn't hurt you? I would love to hear the perspective of a believer about that passage.

Any moron can babble in a made up language, where are all the real Christians who are ready to prove their faith by drinking poison?

BrotherDan, sorry about taking the thread off topic. To answer the orginal question, I don't believe in demons or satan, so naturally I don't believe in demonic possesion. I also don't believe in talking donkeys, it was very liberating for me when I came to the realization that just because something is in the Bible doesn't mean it's true.

SweetBabyCheezits

I think we have enough proof of holy spirit and Gods full revelation and there is no need for more of it today.

Proof or faith? I'd really like more proof, please. Some good, testable proof of holy spirit. Hell, I'd take proof of demons even. (And not someone's video footage of crap flying off a table or some claimed exorcism in South America.) I would demand exactly the same proof of a sasquatch or Nessie sighting.

BD, what do you consider to be proof of holy spirit? I'm not trying to stir anything up but I am curious.

Demons and the WTS