Why You Loyal Witnesses Should Oppose Disfellowshipping

by metatron 33 Replies latest jw friends

  • miseryloveselders
    miseryloveselders

    Dear Mrs. Peck

    The problem with Disfellowshipping™ is that the average JW does not know the reason why someone is DFd. There is no transparency to the proceedings that allow for the actual process to be critiqued and ensure that appropriate measures have been taken. The punishment is the same whether the "crime" was something like smoking in private - which harms nobody but the person doing it - or actual crimes like child molestation or murder which put people in the congregation and general public at risk.

    Far too often people who have committed crimes get away with their criminal activity under the WTS's insane Two Eyewitness™ rule - thus being sheltered from having justice served, while at the same time keeping perpetrators in proximity to their victims and in a position where they can victimize other people.

    Why should someone like me, whose only "crime" is a fundamental, conscientious disagreement with WTS policy be punished more severely than someone who molests a child and claims to be Repentant™?

    Powerful post. The bible is full of individuals who were considered good folks in God's eyes, yet had disfellowshipable offenses. David would have been convicted of conspiracy to commit murder, and disfellowshipped considering all the circumstances. Abraham had his fair share of women, so did Solomon and Samson. Ok, so they weren't Christians, but they were all listed by the WT as fine representatives of God's chosen people.

    If we're discussing disagreement with the WT's beliefs, what about Jonah openly disagreeing with God? What about the disagreements early Christians had with one another and the fact that gray areas such as circumcision could be left up to one's conscience in consideration of one's background and also the fulfillment of the Law. With the WT today, there are no gray areas. They view you poorly for growing facial hair, or wearing a blazer instead of a full suit. Or when it comes to areas that aren't even gray, but rather black and white such as them being dead wrong on 607 B.C., they force you to accept what they say. Not only accept it, but promote it to other people as truth even though you know its friggin wrong.

    My personal opinion, when it comes to individuals who call themselves Christians, and have developed an outrageous reputation for sinful behavior, to the point that outside people can look at him/her and sarcastically say, "he's a good Christian", then I can understand some kind of sanction by his church/congregation. I still don't agree with disfellowshipping as its done now. It doesn't get to the root of the matter, all it does is enforce uniformity, even if the problem remains hidden. If you believe in Christianity, and the ransom, then you believe that we're all inherently sinful as were all the people listed in the bible were, although they were still listed as fine representatives of God's organization. They had worse offenses than the average person gets DFd for today.

    It is particulary sad that someone can force themselves sexually on a child and face less sanction from the WT, than one who disagrees with 607 vs 587.

  • tec
    tec

    For one thing, the Witnesses do want to keep the congregation clean, meaning keeping out immoral and otherwise "sinful" behavior.

    This, unfortunately, would mean an empty congregation. (or fortunately, depending on your perspective) because everyone sins. Lack of mercy being one of the sins that Jesus spoke directly against. You can't kick out everyone who doesn't follow what you have deemed to be moral. It has the feel of cleaning the outside of the cup, when inside there are still hypocrites and judgmental/merciless people.

    Most churches do not even look at what their members are doing, nor do they seem to care. If you are a person that follows the bible,then such behaviors should not be accepted within a church setting as it is a direct contradiction of what religion is supposed to be about. Most organized religions are more concerned with keeping their members and having a rather large number of them maybe in order to collect more money??

    I don't belong to a church or an organization, but even I believe that many churches don't kick their members out simply because they understand that they do not have the right to deny access to God and His Son. (I don't believe that access is granted through a church, mind you, but for the people who do believe this...) Nor would these church leaders want to deny access to anyone. Perhaps by allowing these gross 'sinners' in, these gross 'sinners' might hear something and come to Christ. Church leaders, etc, have the domain of sharing that hope, not withholding it.

    However with that being said, we do live in a society today that refuses to take responsibility for their actions. It seems that very few people are ever held accountable. I think that maybe a little moral accountability is not such a bad thing.

    But morally accountable to whom? An organization? Or to God and His Son?

    Just some thoughts.

    Tammy

  • carla
    carla

    I once asked a MS this re:df-ing-- If Christians (I use the term loosely in the case of jw's as I do not consider them Christian by any stretch of the imagination but they think they are so...)If Christians are supposed to be a 'light' for the world how can they be that 'light' when they nearly cut themselves off from the rest of the world? Particularly 'wayward' family members. How can they be an example for their family when they just toss them to the curb? How can an unbeliever or one who has made a mistake learn by example then? Who would want to follow a jw example? he had no answer but in my opinion he looked shamed, as well he should be.

    I went on to ask about the numerous unseen 'sins' by jw's on a regular basis of which none are df'd for. My point was that these often more public 'sins' were often no less 'sinful' than the public seen 'sins' but it doesn't make it any less of a 'sin'. As long as appearances are upheld then a jw if free to sin as they like, just don't get caught. In Christian lives, one chooses not to 'sin' out of love for God not fear of being found out.

    In my opinion jw's do not live for their jah but rather for the elders and appearances. Nothing more than lip service. Certainly not spirituality.

    In reading ex-jw forums for years now I have come to the conclusion that all you ex jw's take far better care of your jw family when they are in need than any jw family or not ever would. I could relate countless stories where ex jw's stepped up to the plate to bathe, feed, diaper change parents, financial help, rides,etc.... and generally take care of family members who have treated you so miserably, there must be a special spot in heaven for you guys. Even those who are agnostic or even atheists now show more 'Christian' love than jw's can even comprehend.

    What a terrible cult that does not allow for natural affections.

  • Butterflyleia85
    Butterflyleia85

    I accept that punishment for my sins was nessary and in the case of disfellowshipped I deserved it in the eyes of being a JW, but it was my first and I was young. After being DFed and getting back in, I decided it was the worst punishment ever. I never realized how much I needed my family and that I would really be shunned for a year! I was ready by 6 months to get back in... but they refused to let me in and I grow really depressed. Finally it lead to self abuse and to greater sins unimagable. I got back in but it was to late I was now consumed by a whole different problem. And after being in I then felt I was progressing all over again yet they wanted me to alreally have that taken care of before getting in and when I sinned I was caught and DFed once again. This time I decided not to get depressed but see the good in me, that I'm better then how I was treated, and had to leave the thinking of JW before truely healing myself. I needed the pride they striped away from me and I needed to feel ok with my life before I ended it. Meeting my husband, reading self help books, come on here as a support, etc. has helped more then you know. So do I thank the Jehovah's Witnesses who abandoned me because of my sins or for the people who truely saw me as an imperfect human that needed help?!

  • palmtree67
    palmtree67

    It's not just the actual disfellowshipping. The "process" of re-instatement that they have invented is harsh, demeaning, humiliating.

    Mrs.Peck:

    Most churches do not even look at what their members are doing, nor do they seem to care.

    You only think that, because that's what you've been told. I believe they do care. But I believe they leave a person's relationship with God, between the person and God. A pastor I know said he felt his calling was to help others have a better relationship with God. Not to dictate and enforce rules.

    ** waves to Tammy **

  • tec
    tec

    **waves back to Palm**

    :)

  • Butterflyleia85
    Butterflyleia85

    Mrs. Peck

    As far as a DF'd person in need, I think that any decent Witness would not deny that person help, it may even be arranged by the Elder body who may choose to extend assistance for that person's basic needs. That is just human decency. I would help that person regardless. And the guidelines regarding DFing state to not actively associate with that perso, say recreationally. Also, guidelines state not to discuss "spiritual matters" with that person (unless you are an Elder offering encouragement to that person to come back). There is nothing that I have ever heard of that incinuates not to help a person in need, even if DFd. I seriously doubt that Jehovah God would look down upon providing care to those who need it. If anything, I would think that is what being a true Christian is about.

    That's what I thought too. but it depends on the Elder... It's a whole different story with me and many of my DFed friends how they treat them in each hall.

    palmtree67

    A pastor I know said he felt his calling was to help others have a better relationship with God. Not to dictate and enforce rules.

    If there was a church like I would go...

  • BluesBrother
    BluesBrother

    Mrs Peck's view of the d/f arrangement is much the same as mine was, when I was "in"..I have known Bro's who took in elderly d/f relatives when there was a need and I have seen some enlightened ones being considerate of a family sister when a parent was very sick to dying (stopped after the funeral of course)

    I have also seen other J W's be very hardnosed about it and refuse basic human needs. I used to doubt the horror stories on the net, but there are so many that I am sure that terrible injustices do happen. I believe the WT have stated that one should not be d/f'd yourself for caring for such a family member . It is a different matter for non family, no matter how close you once were..such ones have apparently proven that they are "not of our sort" 1 John 2 :19...

    Of course , that was back in the day...Things change, a new K M article and the pendulum can swing turning dubs in a different direction like the sheep they are. If the WT says "No"...the dubs will shun their nearest and formerly dearest.

  • cyberjesus
    cyberjesus

    ostracism is a form of mental abuse.

  • Butterflyleia85
    Butterflyleia85

    My grandma is from Japan I wonder if that is why she is so strict about not even say congradulations on me having a baby... My grandma on my mom side on the other hand came into the truth cause of my grandpa and his sister... I wonder if she had doubts all along and that is why she is so easy going about it.

    The elders are kinda like that I think based on how they were brought up gives them a conscience of weither or not to treat DFment with strictness or with a kinder side. The hall i was brought up in is so stricted and set on sticking with the rules and the hall I was going to saw it more benefial to be more inviting and incouraging on what they were allowed to do... they even gave me their number and said call us if you need anything.

Share this

Google+
Pinterest
Reddit