Does the Bible Teach a Second Chance After Death?

by Ding 24 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Ding
    Ding

    The Bible teaches a resurrection of the dead, but does it teach a second chance after death or a judgment based on our life before we died?

    Hebrews 9:27 says: " Just as man is destined to die once, and after that to face judgment, 28 so Christ was sacrificed once to take away the sins of many people; and he will
    appear a second time, not to bear sin, but to bring salvation to those who are waiting for him."

    This doesn't seem to teach a second chance after death.

    I don't want to rehash everything that was said in the thread about the rich man and Lazarus, but if that story is about what happens after people die, it doesn't seem to indicate any second chance for the rich man who died.

    If there is a second chance after death, why wouldn't everyone eventually be saved? Who would be so stupid as to come back from the dead, get a second chance, and then decide to rebel against God and be condemned?

    If you think the Bible teaches a second chance after death, could you please cite the passages in support of your view?

  • snowbird
    snowbird

    Hebrews 9:27 was what caused me to question WT's doctrine that we pay for our sins at death.

    I no longer believe that.

    Also, with God, I don't believe there are any first or second chances, only blessings or maledictions.

    Blessings, if we hearken to his counsel.

    Maledictions, if we don't.

    Syl

  • Terry
    Terry

    What is human identity but a series of decisions, choices, selections/rejections of behavior?

    We are driven by the necessity of maintenance. Which is to say we must sustain our life hour to hour through our own efforts.

    The raw materials of life can be plentiful or wholly absent in our search for survival at one extreme and entertainment and pleasure on the other.

    This is an accident of birth whether we are the offspring of bounty or oppression.

    The playing field for good choices is not level by any means.

    We could be born in a land of poverty with superstition and political malfeasance surrounding us or we could be born to loving welcoming nuclear family with wealth and education abundantly provided. That gray middle area constitutes the "norm" for many of us.

    What is our "chance" but to exploit our rational understanding of necessity using whatever means are available?

    If we are to be judged by some transcendant being on our thoughts and behavior it must be understood we DID NOT CHOOSE those thoughts or behavior any more than we chose our parents, wealth, education level or country of origin and social norms. That is potluck.

    Christianity grew up with the advantages of an outrageously successful (almost 2000 year duration) infrastructure of the Roman Empire setting it in motion with foundational stability and the power of the state to oppose factions, sects and non-orthodoxy.

    This lasted until the Protestant so-called "Reformation" when christianity went rogue with wild-assed notions of interpretation and instantaneous fractures into splinters of denominational instability.

    When and where we are born into that boiling cauldron of stew is largely the most random of all random flavorings which imbues our tastes for "obdedience, belief, ethics and naivete."

    Death has always ended the forward motion of the individual person.

    Greed for more and better notwithstanding!

    Nothing by way of evidence for life beyond this life has ever amounted to much more than radical claims, hearsay and imagination.

    With only this life to deal with FOR CERTAIN, the success or failure of each of us devolves down to making the best of what we have.

    A rational acceptance of that is the beginning of wisdom.

    Believers are largely spoiled and naive children whining for more than they have on their plate.

    The party game of My God is bigger than Yours occupies way too much time as a distraction and a motivation for violent jealousy.

    Who you are and how you treat others can either be a very personal and rational choice or it can be a brutish knee-jerk ideological habit.

    But, no higher and invisible hand stays your decision nor rewards or punishes the wisdom or foolshiness of your intention.

  • PSacramento
    PSacramento

    What do you mean by "second chance" ?

  • Ding
    Ding

    By no second chance, I mean that God resurrects people for judgment, determining the person's eternal destiny based on the decisions he made before he died.

    By second chance, I mean that the person is resurrected and given an opportunity to prove himself worthy of everlasting life based on what he does after he is resurrected.

  • PSacramento
    PSacramento

    That is a good question.

    It seems that for some, those that die without ever truly knowing God, that a second chance would be deserving.

    The price for sinning is death, but there is a final judgment of all, both living ( when the day comes) and those that are dead and ressurected.

    The bible makes the case for death being the wage we pay for sin but it also makes a case for a final judgment of the ressurected.

  • tec
    tec

    I think you're asking do people get a second chance, after they have died, to prove themselves worthy by the resurrection? I don't see that the bible teaches this at all.

    There seems to be no judgment at all for those who are IN CHRIST - or for those who have done good to those who are IN CHRIST, because it is the same as doing good to Christ. As for the rest, those who do not believe or know anyone IN CHRIST to do bad or good to them, then I think those are judged according to the deeds they committed while alive.

    Tammy

  • greendawn
    greendawn

    That's exactly what it does, with the resurrection of all the dead why are they resurrected but to get a second chance especially if they have mitigating circumstances such as having suffered from ignorance or coercion. Otherwise it seems that one's actions in the first life will have a bearing during the second life for some even leading to humiliation.

  • Ding
    Ding

    The quote from Hebrews was to the effect that people die and then comes judgment.

    Where does it say that the purpose of resurrection is a second chance?

    Greendawn has presented an argument that resurrection has to do with mitigating circumstances, but where does the Bible SAY this?

  • MarcusScriptus
    MarcusScriptus

    Christianity outside of the Watchtower, and even shared by some Evangelistic Fundamentalists (some Pentecost churches for example, of which my father was one), is that there is a resurrection of the physical body at the end of history or time.

    To translate that for those of us who are from a JW background, this means that what Christendom has always generally always believed is that the immortal soul is NOT the end of result of humans after they die. As both the Apostle Creed and the Nicene Creed teach, there will be a resurrection of everyone’s physical body, a time when the souls of people will be reunited with the same type of body Christ had upon being resurrected. This resurrection is called “the resurrection of the just and unjust” (“righteous and unrighteous”) both inside and outside the Bible. (Luke 14:14; Acts 24:15; Revelation 20: 4, 5) For them—Catholics, Orthodox, and Protestants—this is the meaning behind Jesus words at John 5:28-29: “The hour is coming when the dead will leave their graves at the sound of his voice and come out: those who did good things to a resurrection of life, and those who did wicked things to a resurrection of judgment.”

    Before continuing, I stress that sharing the upcomng information should not be confused with my advocating believing it or as declaring that the following represent my personal convictions.

    The Watchtower Has Its Own Dictionary When It Comes to Resurrection and Body

    As those outside of Watchtower influence understand it, the Greek word “anastasis” (where the name Anastasia comes from) refers to a corporeal body standing up again after it has been struck down by death. Like the Hellenists of the apostle Paul’s day, Jehovah’s Witnesses don’t really understand the word as it applies to Scripture or eschatological theology. The Hellenist religion held that all had an immortal soul that lived on in this state of spirit for eternity after death. The Romans even burned the bodies of their dead because they thought it was all over for the flesh. When Paul talked about the resurrection of Jesus, implying that it was guaranteed for all who believed in the “Unknown God,” the Greeks mocked him. Why bring the soul back into the body? The body was weak in their minds, and most had been burned to ashes after death. Why would any soul need to “stand up again” after death?—Acts 17:32

    Christianity is the religion of a resurrection of the body—for everyone, good and evil. This is called Judgment Day in their theology. They thus read all Scriptural references of Judgment Day with this picture in mind. Good and evil people are reunited with their soul in physical bodies that far exceed the reach and ability our frail bodies have today. Bodily resurrection is NOT a reward in the eyes of Christians, but the next stage in human development after the current era of affairs ends at Armageddon.

    But to the Jehovah’s Witnesses and their theology, a resurrection IS a reward. And for the Witnesses there can be a resurrection to life as a spirit as well as to a corporeal one.

    This belief, we all know, is very problematic. As noted above and in other parts of Scripture, evil doers are spoken of as being raised from the dead. This makes no sense at all to the Witness and his/her theology. That is why the Governing Body has gone back and forth so many times regarding the question : Will the people destroyed at Sodom and Gomorrah receive a resurrection? To Christians the answer is simple. To those who believe resurrection is a reward, there is only confusion.

    God Gets “Stuck”

    Also, the word “resurrection” is linked to the word “body,” both words in Greek and in Christian theology relating strictly and exclusively to the corporeal. Not only has the caused a confusing JW interpretation of 1 Corinthians 15 where Paul uses the term “natural body” in contrast to there being a “spiritual” one (something he would not have to do if it was apparent that spirits had bodies—and this has proved to be the most difficult point to explain to new ex-JWs after leaving the Watchtower because they cannot conceive the no-spirit-body concept). This has caused the paradox of having to invent a theology of a “body for Jehovah.”

    According to Christians, spirits don’t have bodies, but JWs teach they do, such as in the old Live Forever book that explained that since God can change his mind, then God must have a spirit brain, and this spirit brain would have to live in something, and thus God must have a spirit body. God thus cannot be omnipresent because he is thus reduced to being stuck in time and space like the Witnesses themselves. This causes many problems when one tries to reason how someone limited by time and space can predict or foresee things.

    Paradise Earth Not Unique...Unless You’re Not Educated Enough to Read

    As for Christendom, they have taught that after the bodily resurrection the final judgment occurs. The “spiritual” body that Paul teaches of in 1 Corinthians becomes a reality, a corporeal body governed by supernatural or spiritual power. For the faithful this means life in a “new heavens and new earth” arrangement. With the earth and the entire physical universe transformed, the realities of heaven and earth become one, and as Revelation states, instead of people leaving earth to live with God, God comes down to dwell with humankind. Exactly how this works they don’t know or even theorize to the extent the Witnesses do. But they do hope in these promises, unlike the claim the Watchtower makes when it lies to people saying that only they believe in a paradise earth for the future. Anyone with enough of a mind to read the Catechism of the Catholic Church can see that such a hope (as highlighted in the ancient creeds) has been held out for over 2,000 years. Even the Pentecostal church my father belonged to taught the very same thing. (What the Witnesses teach is neither new or unique as they often claim.)--Catechism of the Catholic Church 1042-1056. See also "What Will Our Resurrected Bodies Be Like?"

    But What the hell About Hell?

    And while this would also mean that the new physical resurrected body would also be doomed to suffer in Hell, one must forget the JW teachings on what Christendom believes about eternal judgment. Except for a few Fundamentalists, the “fire and brimstone” are symbolic of what life with love and human contact must be like. Hell is the condition of living with God, and thus without anything that reflects God-like qualities. One thus doesn’t experience other persons or demons or light or enlightenment or anything else.

    One must also understand that Christians teach that they cannot say for certain if anyone is or will ever exist in Hell. As far as they know it is a radical possibility for those who do not get saved by God, but since salvation depends on the justice and mercy of this Judge who is Love personified, it is also a possibility that no one may ever eventually exist there. Possible? Yes. Will it be? Only God knows. The things that the Watchtower teaches that other religions believe about Hell does not represent current Christian eschatology, even for most Evangelical Fundamentalists who have a strict sola scriptura approach to theology.

    To understand how and why Christian eschatology holds that there is a judgment after death, one has to be willing to let go of the Witness teachings. This includes the Governing Body’s interpretation and use of texts such as Hebrews 9:27. A second chance after death? The JWs say yes for those on earth but no if you go to heaven. That is confusing if you try to apply what they teach, doesn't it?

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