Are they really that bad???

by anonymous4 310 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  Butterflyleia85

  Design, Yeah that’s cool you been… and I know they’re out there… good churches I mean… Church of God for one or yes some kind of nondenominational church. Right now just doing research and finding support on this board has help a lot. There are a lot on here that has knowledge of the bible and other religions.

  I’m really no debater just a person that likes to learn and give out what I’ve learned.

  Going into Debator’s comment…. We are not meant to use the bible alone. We are supposed to be a flock learning together.

  If you cannot even get that right what are your chances with the rest of the Bible?

  I so don’t want to debate with a debater… the scriptures say Romans 14:2; Accept other believers who are weak in faith, and don't argue with them about what they think is right or wrong.
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  wasblind

  Debator says: " The watchtowers and other publications are to support the Bible and they are never said to be inspired which means they do have to be refined all the time."

  2 Timothy 3:16 says: "All scripture is inspired of God and beneficial for teaching, for reproving, for setting things straight, for disciplining in righteousness, that the man of God may be fully competent, completely equipped for every good work. "

  My question to Debator is: Why would the inspired words of the Bible need support from uninspired WT magazines ???

  Again, why would the Bible, whose stance have never changed, need support from a publishing Co. that's always changin'

  it's view on what they think the Bible is saying ????
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  Black Sheep

  Your accusations only fit if we do claim inspiration for our publications as Jehovah's witnesses this last 100+ years But we do not and never have claimed inspiration!

  They still expect you to treat their blitherings as though they are inspired.

  This article from WT 1943 entitled Righteous Requirements claims it's now outdated garbage has come from "The Lord..."

  

  

  
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  isaacaustin

  Reniaa said:

  Your accusations only fit if we do claim inspiration for our publications as Jehovah's witnesses this last 100+ years But we do not and never have claimed inspiration!

  My reply:

  Only (according to the WT) when we are speaking of the WT. When the WT is speaking of other religions, it is simply announcing a date that something is going to happen and stamping God's name on it. The WT uses two sets of scales- one for themself and another for all others. However, they do on one hand deny inspiration...but on the the other hand claim to be God's modern-day prophet and his earthly channel of communication...negating any denial of inspiration.

  Face it Reniaa, the org that you idolize and aspire to defend (but not be a part of as you frequent apostate websites and don't go to meetings or in service) is a false prophet and YOU are a false prophet for defending them. Reniaa you false prophet you!!
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  isaacaustin

  Debator/Reniaa says: " The watchtowers and other publications are to support the Bible and they are never said to be inspired which means they do have to be refined all the time."

  My reply: But the Wt failed the test of being refined BIG-TIME! In 1918 they were sent away into Babylonish captivity due to being unclean in ways such as celebrating Christmas and using the cross. They were supposedly released from this refining captivity in an unrefined state. They were still practicing these same 'unclean practices. This belies their claim that God then appointed these dirty, apostate false Christians as his earthly steward, since they refused to be refined.
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  debator

  Hi huffnung.

  The hope is life it always has been. Whether it is on earth or in heaven the life is the same as opposed to the death we inherited from Adam's sin.

  I used scriptures but you refuse to accept that there has to be harmony between Hebrew and Greek scriptures.

  I suppose you believe we will all be kings and priests in heaven ruling over a few cows and sheep on the now defunct earth?

  "The meek shall inherit the earth" Jesus 's words supporting and quoting psalms from the hebrew scriptures showing the harmony and agreement.

  How do you explain that?

  Your trying to say that we cannot have some people on earth and some in heaven but the Bible doesn't support your stance.

  Matthew 6:9 onwards a prayer we are all familiar with. In this Jesus talks praying for his father's Jehovah's will to be done on earth as it has in heaven. Are you saying this is a lie or that we are praying for earth to be empty or destroyed?

  Theology if it is just constructed from one or two scriptures as you have done without checking it against what the Bible teaches as a whole is how the majority of contradictions are made.

  The promises for the earth are a biblical fact that we have to address. We do not use scripture to cancel other scriptures out. We have to find a harmonious teaching that fits all the scriptures involved.
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  wasblind

  Debator,

  the fact that you have ignored my last post on this thread speaks volumes
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  debator

  Hi jookbeard

  I think whichever way of expelling someone for division was used you would quibble.

  The greek scriptures are very clear that division isn't an option for Christians.

  You say only voicing "an opinion" but the fruitage is always far-reaching and has consequences. We have to be responsible for the words that come out of our mouths and were they lead. Some words have caused wars and sent people to their deaths and allowed others to be neglected.

  Before you become a Jehovah's witnesses you have the chance to test their teachings against all other religions that are on offer and more importantly against the measure for all Religions (especially those claiming to be Christian) which is God's word the Bible.

  For me there was no contest. Jehovah's witnesses have a Bible clarity no other religion or personal opinion even comes close too, right down to our insistence on unity of the flock.

  Also this site and those lost sheep on it actually gives me further proof.....What happens to all those doubters and stumbled ones on here? The only thing you now agree upon is your negativity over witnesses, all else is a blur of whatever wind of teaching appeals to you whether it be atheism, mysticism, paganism, trinitarianism, anti-establishment or personal preference etc.

  On here the fruitage of your choices has led you to disunity of any common held belief or teaching beyond your rejection of Witnesses.

  Most threads and forum on here are simply reaffirming your negativity over Witnesses. This is your common ground between each other. I see no other on here.

  And if all Jehovah's Witnesses disappeared tomorrow what would you all do? What would you talk about? Where would you go? Except your separate ways as suddenly the reason that connects you all is gone and the lack of any common held belief between you means there is no longer anything to keep you together.

  Division again is your fruitage on here.
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  debator

  Hi wasblind

  I do not come on here much and I was getting to you.

  I answered your question earlier to others. Uninspired writings are allowed as a practical application of the administration of the congregation and to highlight when bible principle is applied to modern cultural issues and prophecy fulfilment recognition. I quoted scriptures earlier that show this.

  We in our imperfection do preach, teach and apply bible scripture and so uninspired works show this but they have to conform to Bible teaching and principle which I fully support that the publications we use do although not infallible hense why they do get refined a lot. Every application of principle or prophecy is checkable against the bible scripture it is derived from.

  The Bible and Jesus gave the shepherds a certain amount of autonomy of administration it is simply practical to write them down as both the greek and hebrew scriptures acknowledge.

  It's always recognising that it is only God's word that is inspired and our uninspired publications are there as supportive but remain subject to error and refinement. You know this on here and that is why anti-witnesses have such fun pointing out the changes of teaching as our biblical knowledge grew as a religion emerging from the apostasy.

  I wouldn't be a witness If they weren't capable of refinement and acceptance of imperfection but that in no way relieves us of have to be united in teaching concerning the Bible.
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  isaacaustin

  Reniaa said:

  I wouldn't be a witness If they weren't capable of refinement and acceptance of imperfection but that in no way relieves us of have to be united in teaching concerning the Bible.

  My reply:

  You're not a JW, obviously. You are a defender of them though (if one wants to call your sorry attempts a defense). However, you can not call the JW's refinable, as they refused to be refined by the Babylonish captivity they were sent away into in 1918. They exited practicing the same acts that got them sent away- belying their claim to be released and chosen as God' earthly steward. Evrything you say that leaps over this and calls them God's people has already been belied by the WT.