by brotherdan 68 Replies latest jw experiences
As for those from whom you fear disobedience, admonish them, forsake them in beds apart, and beat them. Then if they obey you, take no further action against them. surely Allah is high, supreme. (4:34)
That's in the bible? Hmmm...
This too?
“Fighting is obligatory for you, much as you may dislike it. (2:216)
brotherdan, you ask those questions as if you know more than we do.
That's an untrue statement. I'm communicating my ideas. I don't claim to be smarter than the next guy. I am trying to prove the point that while it's not kosher, there MUST be definite truth. And I think I've been reasonable in saying that either atheism is true or Christianity is true or Muslims are true, or none are true. But there cannot be 2 conflicting truths.
It's been interesting to see how worked up you've all gotten over this indesputable fact.
Also, while there IS bloodshed in the Bible, it is not commanded as it is in the Koran. The Koran is a "hate" book.
Dan, I enter this discussion with assumption that my entire post would be responded to rather than one small part of it. There were relovant questions I asked you that go along with the one sentance you quoted.
If you are going to ignore the rest of my post, thats your poragitive, but if thats the case i'll bow out of this discussion for now as its a waste of my time to make a thoughtful answer to a thread you started and have you simply take one part of it and ignore the rest.
Perhaps you dont have the time now, and were planning a fuller response later. Hopefully thats the case.
If not, thats fine too. I'll know where we stand. Respect.
No, but the bloodshed in the OT, specifically genocide, was commanded of the Israelites by God, was it not? If you're going to excuse what's in the Bible for certain reasons, you have to do the same with the Q'uran. Cheating scales.
As for those from whom you fear disobedience, admonish them, forsake them in beds apart, and beat them. Then if they obey you, take no further action against them. surely Allah is high, supreme. (4:34)
Stoning disobediant children. Nuff said.
Are we commanded to do that today?
Also, while there IS bloodshed in the Bible, it is not commanded as it is in the Koran. The Koran is a "hate" book.
Dan, either you are in denial or you aren't reading the same Bible.
Suppose you hear in one of the towns the LORD your God is giving you that some worthless rabble among you have led their fellow citizens astray by encouraging them to worship foreign gods. In such cases, you must examine the facts carefully. If you find it is true and can prove that such a detestable act has occurred among you, you must attack that town and completely destroy all its inhabitants, as well as all the livestock. Then you must pile all the plunder in the middle of the street and burn it. Put the entire town to the torch as a burnt offering to the LORD your God. That town must remain a ruin forever; it may never be rebuilt. Keep none of the plunder that has been set apart for destruction. Then the LORD will turn from his fierce anger and be merciful to you. He will have compassion on you and make you a great nation, just as he solemnly promised your ancestors. "The LORD your God will be merciful only if you obey him and keep all the commands I am giving you today, doing what is pleasing to him." (Deuteronomy 13:13-19 NLT)
They entered into a covenant to seek the Lord, the God of their fathers, with all their heart and soul; and everyone who would not seek the Lord,the God of Israel, was to be put to death, whether small or great, whether man or woman. (2 Chronicles 15:12-13 NAB)
If your own full brother, or your son or daughter, or your beloved wife, or you intimate friend, entices you secretly to serve other gods, whom you and your fathers have not known, gods of any other nations, near at hand or far away, from one end of the earth to the other: do not yield to him or listen to him, nor look with pity upon him, to spare or shield him, but kill him. Your hand shall be the first raised to slay him; the rest of the people shall join in with you. You shall stone him to death, because he sought to lead you astray from the Lord, your God, who brought you out of the land of Egypt, that place of slavery. And all Israel, hearing of this, shall fear and never do such evil as this in your midst. (Deuteronomy 13:7-12 NAB)
Suppose a man or woman among you, in one of your towns that the LORD your God is giving you, has done evil in the sight of the LORD your God and has violated the covenant by serving other gods or by worshiping the sun, the moon, or any of the forces of heaven, which I have strictly forbidden. When you hear about it, investigate the matter thoroughly. If it is true that this detestable thing has been done in Israel, then that man or woman must be taken to the gates of the town and stoned to death. (Deuteronomy 17:2-5 NLT)
Are we commanded to do that today?
Double standard, buddy. Apply the same perspective to the violent passages of the Quran as you do the Bible.
The Quran is violent but the Bible is not?
Kill Anyone who Approaches the Tabernacle
For the LORD had said to Moses, 'Exempt the tribe of Levi from the census; do not include them when you count the rest of the Israelites. You must put the Levites in charge of the Tabernacle of the Covenant, along with its furnishings and equipment. They must carry the Tabernacle and its equipment as you travel, and they must care for it and camp around it. Whenever the Tabernacle is moved, the Levites will take it down and set it up again. Anyone else who goes too near the Tabernacle will be executed.' (Numbers 1:48-51 NLT)
Kill People for Working on the Sabbath
The LORD then gave these further instructions to Moses: 'Tell the people of Israel to keep my Sabbath day, for the Sabbath is a sign of the covenant between me and you forever. It helps you to remember that I am the LORD, who makes you holy. Yes, keep the Sabbath day, for it is holy. Anyone who desecrates it must die; anyone who works on that day will be cut off from the community. Work six days only, but the seventh day must be a day of total rest. I repeat: Because the LORD considers it a holy day, anyone who works on the Sabbath must be put to death.' (Exodus 31:12-15 NLT)
You can beat your slaves but not so hard that they die... that's too far.
When a man strikes his male or female slave with a rod so hard that the slave dies under his hand, he shall be punished. If, however, the slave survives for a day or two, he is not to be punished, since the slave is his own property. (Exodus 21:20-21 NAB)
Those passages I quoted from the Koran are commands that are to be followed by followers TODAY! It's not a double standard, dude. The Bible does not command me to beat my wife into submission. The Koran DOES.
