WELCOME Doubtful -- glad you are here.
Pray for our Brothers in Japan
by doubtful 46 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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zeroday*
And exactly who are we praying to...a deity that keeps count of prayers and if that number is not met "OH well not enough prayers so F**K you" god...
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Listener
I am so sorry to hear of your struggles doubtful, it is very sad that you have experienced this in your young life. I do wonder if your physical disability has had something to do with the rejection that you have had. It is very unchristian and I hope that this doesn't continue in your life. Although we can put much hope in being accepted by others you have been looking for this generally in other young ones who do not have the maturity or inclination to overlook differences that they see in others.
Your mother has been pushing things under the carpet, maybe because she doesn't know how to deal with it. You don't mention any father figure being in your life and if that is so then you have missed much that this possible could have provided you. I find it very wrong that JWs are of the opinion that the young ones cannot and should not approach their elders in the congregation for clarification of their uncertainties. It is not always the case and there are some sincere brothers that would welcome discussions.
There is a lot of misunderstanding about prayers and our expectations from them. God has already set his timetable and laid out his plans. Praying does give us strength and we do well to pray for not only the Brothers in Japan but all those affected, that they also may come to be strengthened and comforted if they can also put their trust in God (if that is not the case already).
Your doubts about the JW's teachings are well founded. There has been much encouragement on this forum to read the book "Crisis of conscience" written by Raymond Franz (now deceased ), a former Governing Body member. I finally finished reading the book yesterday. It took me two days and I could hardly stop reading. He puts such an enlightening perspective on the religion and it's beliefs that it opens the mind. I was overwhelmed with what he had to say. He is not encouraging people to leave the religion but he exposes it in such a way that it leaves one with a clear understanding of its workings and a clear conscience if one chooses not to accept those teachings. The most wonderful aspect of his writings is the encouragement of keeping a close relationship with God and Jesus. Personally any doubts that I had that I was not doing the right thing by rejecting the organisation were washed away and a new confidence in maintaining my relationship with God and Jesus has taken place and he explains very specifically how this can be done. I encourage you to read it and even if you stay in the religion because of your mother it will give you a new perspective which will make it easier for you to carry on even in the religion.
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doubtful
@zeroday - my sentiments exactly.
@listener - Thank your for your caring response. As for my father, I have not seen him since I moved out of state 6 years ago. He lived with my mother and, not as my mother's husband, but more like a roomate all my life. He was a drug addict who frequently refused to work, was in an out of rehab, and not a very good father. The elders refused to grant my mom their blessing for a divorce, and told her to remain in subjection to him, even though he refused to "take the lead" in any sense. She suffered 15 years of loveless marriage with him, and was often the one supporting him financially. The elders finally granted her permission to divorce, on the grounds of "willfull non-support". Now as a woman in her 50s, her prospects for remarriage are slim to none. I hate to admit it but I loathe my father.
As for the Raymond Franz book..I would like to read it, but I can't. I live in my mother's home, and I can't keep the book in the house anywhere for fear that she'll discover it. It's a disfellowing offense to read apostate material. I was hoping to find a free pdf version of it online, but the most I've ever seen are the few excerpts that amount to only a few pages out of the book.
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GLTirebiter
Welcome, Doubtful!
Also, why do we need to pray? Why is it so important that I pray for the brothers in Japan? Is Jehovah's mercy and his providing emotional support and his holy spirit to the brothers of Japan contingent upon my prayers, and the total number of prayers made by other witnesses?
If you pray to affect God's plan, that is presumptuous. Prayer is about changing our own actions and attitudes, not changing God's. If you pray to align your own heart and mind with the love and mercy the Lord taught us and commanded us to follow, to make yourself some small part of that plan and show empathy and charity for those who have suffered or died because of this tragedy, that is what prayer is about.
Pray for all who are affected, not just your Witness brothers and sisters. Then help make those prayers effective by aiding the response; allow grace and the Spirit to work through you by supporting the aid agencies who are helping the victims, to the extent that you can do so. "Do unto others," etc.
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doubtful
@Gltirebiter - Thank you!
So, it's presumptous to pray for changes to God's plan, or to ask that he intervene in human affairs? Then why do several scriptures in the New Testament implore Christians to pray for their brothers and sisters? Apparently the early Christians believed that they should pray for God to do something to help others, and they believed that this made a difference. Again I'm faced with the dillema - either the witnesses are right, or the bible isn't the inspired word of God. Now I know many of you have joined other churches and believe in the bible still, but most of my doubts about the JW organization arises from the myriads of contradictions and scientific impossiblities in the bible. So much of what they believe and do and force on other people results from their stubborn insistence on literally interpreting the bible and adhering to its every word, even if doing so violates all reason and a mountain of contradictory evidence. For instance, they reason if the bible says that two or more persons must witness a sin in order to validate an accusation, then by God that is what we must follow! Even when this applies to allegations of child sexual abuse. What? There wasn't another person present when this man was unmercifully raping this seven year old girl to testify to the validity of her accusation? Gee, oh well. Perhaps the seven year old girl is making this up, because you know, kids often make up these things. It can't be proven then. The man must be presumed innocent, and we musn't notify the authorities so as to continue to project an image of moral perfection to the outside world. There must be two witnesses. The bible says so.
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doubtful
As a follow up to that last post of mine, I wish to comment on the two witness rule. Often, the bible establishes a rule used to adjudicate an issue or to provide a guiding principle for decisions. For instance, in the levitcal law allegations about a woman's having not been a virgin prior to the consumation of her marriage was settled by the evidence of her hymen rupturing or lack thereof. This is a good general principle to follow when it's the woman's word against the man's, but many women rupture their hymen prior to having sex. Those poor women were condemned to die for something they didn't do.
Or what about the issue of allegations of rape? Again, without modern forensic evidence, it was a case of her word against his. So, they used the simple guiding principle of - if she screams, then she was raped. If not, it must have been consensual. Well, what if no one in the city was around to hear her? Most rapists are calculating perpetrators who often try to avoid detection. I imagine if someone was going to rape a woman or a young girl, they would try to silence her by gagging her or covering her mouth, or threatening to kill her with a knife if she screamed. Again, this is a case of a generally reasonable principle, which doesn't necessarily work well in all cases.
The same thing applies to the two-witness rule. It's a good idea to have the two witness rule so as to protect innocents ones wrongfully accused. It's designed to prevent slander and its consequences. Yet, there are some cases, - such as rape or child sexual abuse - where there will never be a second witness to the crime. In such cases, other evidence must be taken into account so as to outweigh the rule. But the bible makes no allowance for exception, or at least it is not explicity stated in the bible..so witness again strictly adhere to this rule, even if it means countless children suffer, and evil men are allowed to get away with committing heinous crimes.
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Open mind
http://www.youtube.com/user/misterdeity#p/c/D835E284A3AC7AA6/3/UaZDcS-rMf4
God's answering machine can get pretty backed up sometimes.
om
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Black Sheep
Welcome to the forum doubtful.
I think you know the answers to most of your questions without our help, but you just don't like the answers or their implications.
Trust yourself.
If something doesn't make sense, it's not because you are stupid or need someone with 'special' knowledge to 'help' you understand. It is because it really doesn't make sense.
Chris
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Curtains
Hi doubtful and welcome- you raise some great points