by Yadirf 28 Replies latest jw friends
Yadirf,
I would like more details or at least know from what source you found your information. As of late, I don't just take somebody's word for it that what I read is correct.
Just the facts man, just the facts.
Is this a light saber in my pocket or am I just happy to see you?
"Hand me that whiskey, I need to consult the spirit."-J.F. Rutherford
Pfff...
1. Was Eden on earth or in Heaven?
There is no proof that a historical Eden ever existed. In the context of the myth, as it gives a location, it seems the writer/s thought of it as somewhere on Earth
2. Was Adam created mortal or immmortal?
There is no proof of a historical Adam as detailed in the Bible. There are those who argue, within the context of the myth, that as eating from the tree would result in death, not eating from the tree would have assured a continuing life, thus being an immortal. Then there are those that argue there is no explicit statement of immortality made in the myth at this point (the Bible as a whole does talk of immortality), and therefore Adam would have died anyway, and was therefore not immortal. As it's a myth, it doesn't really matter, does it?
3. If Adam had not sinned, would he ever had died?
See answer to 2. Depending on your view of this, yes, no, or doesn't matter.
4. If he had lived forever, would you have called it immortality?
Immortality is generaly defined as "living or lasting forever, or used figuratively as very special and famous and therefore likely to be remembered for a long time" (Cambridge). Within the context of the myth, the answer is yes.
5. On account of sin, he did die, so does not that prove he was mortal?
Within the context of the myth, his death proved his material body was mortal.
6. Is there a difference between eternal life and immortality?
Eternal means "lasting forever or for a very long time; never ending" (Cambridge), so, unless then language is being loaded for the use of religious indoctrination, no.
7. Can a man live eternally and yet be mortal?
No. Mortal means "of living things, esp. people unable to continue living forever; having to die". It would seem that, in dictionary terms, one cannot live eternally and be mortal. See coment at 6. above re. loaded language.
8. If Adam had not sinned and then brought death upon himself, where would he have spent endless life?
Within the context of the myth, on Earth unless God had given him fresh instructions. Bit like Newtons First Law.
9. Would he have lived forever in the earthly paradise where he was placed, or would he later got to Heaven?
See answer to 2. Same sort of thing for this question.
10. If Adam could not go to Heaven without dying and could not die without sinning, does not that prove that sin and death are a blessing to mankind?
Hahahahahahahahaha. Funny question, very much a 'can of worms' as it implies that suffering is neccesary for reward, i.e. god, as interpreted by some religionists, is a nasty piece of work who has made severe misrepresentations about itself.
11. Did Adam and his race lose an earthly home or heavenly?
See answer to 2. Same sort of thing for this question.
12. If Jesus Christ came to restore to the race that which was lost through Adam's fall, what will be restored?
See answer to 2. Either you believe he came to asure us entry to heaven, or that we will once again gain immortality, or that it's all a bit Easter Bunny to be bothered with.
13. Was Adam a single individual or two in one?
My reading of the myth indicates he was one person, although no doubt someone will say antitypical at some point; I can feel it in my water.
14. If Adam was composed of two parts--soul and body--which part was the real Adam?
This is a deceitful little twist of the previous question. Q13 asks if he was a single individual. Q14 now, without any segue what-so-ever, jumps to a discussion of if Adam had a soul, without establishing the backing of such a concept in either mythic or scientific terms. That aside, most allegedly Biblically-based concepts of immortal souls regard the body as a wrapper; there is no personality on the part of the body in itself. In the science-fiction fairy story, Deep Space 9, there is a character that is a commensual symbiont that shares a personality with it's host anthropoid.
15. Which part was it that could think, feel, and understand and be responsible for its conduct?
Answer to Q14 covers this.
16. Which part was it that sinned--soul or body?
Answer to Q14 covers this. Typical CHristian view is soul is mind, body is wrapper, therefore both, as mind instigated it and body performed it. Although you can't really blame the body, but, hey, it's a fairy story, lets not get bogged down when it doesn't make sense.
17. If it was the body that sinned and was condemned, why is it said that souls have to be saved?
Meaningless question without specific quote. Who said, where, when?
18. If it was the soul that sinned and was condemned, why did the innocent body have to suffer for it?
Answer to Q14 covers this.
19. In Gen. 2:17, what part of Adam did God refer to when He said, "Thou shalt surely die!"?
It doesn't say, although, within context, one can assume one, other, or both, depending what other bits of the Bible you quote to support it. This is a typical Bible King question; how do you want it? Have it your way!
20. What did the word "Thou" refer to in Gen.2:17?
Rusty on archaic pronouns I am, and typing like Yoda too. Plural of you?
21. If you say soul, then what does "Thou" refer to in Gen. 3:19?
Can't be arsed looking up the scripture.
22. How many different penalties were passed upon Adam?
Well, there was the off-side penalty, a holding penalty, a penalty for a late tackle, and a penalty for not having a TV license... oh, and one rather heavy one for eating fruit/fucking this naked woman he woke up with that god told him to fuck... "bone of my bones" was Adam talking about himself... Shwing!
23. Was one penalty passed against his soul and another against his body?
It doesn't say and anyone who says it does should be careful in citing scriptures to back it, as not everyone may have their model of the Magic Christian Secret Decoder Ring.
24. Then explain Ezekial 18:4 and Eccl. 9:5, 10.
Can't be arsed looking up the scriptures. Julie's pretty good at this sort of thing. Me science boy, she bible girl.
25. Is the penalty mentioned at Gen.2:17 different from the one mentioned at Gen. 3:19?
Can't be arsed looking up the scriptures.
26. If there was just one penalty, what was it?
Errr... handball? Forward pass? No, no, that's Rugby... oh, death, and being the bad guy in a fairy story. I'm getting bored.
27. Does the Bible say it was death or burning in endless life in Hell?
It says death in the directly connected passages. Other passages written by other goatherds at other points in the Bronze Age might not agree with this, but that's hardly surprising. Grimm's Fairy Tales do not share a consonant fantasy Universe with Anne McCaffery's Dragon Riders, do they? Why should two Bible books agree with each other? Oh... you think they were inspired... *shrugs* Show me the proof.
28. Suppose after the Adamic sin, no Savior came, where would the human race spend eternity?
On Earth, unless we "Go boldly... " (within context of myth).
29. Did Jesus really die on the cross?
It says he did, unless they're playing silly buggers with words again. Die is "to stop living or existing, either suddenly or slowly". Jesus certainly stopped living in a physical body, apart from a few guest appearances here and there (allegedly). Did Gandalf really die in the fight with the Balrog? Well?
30. Or was it just His body that died?
See what I mean about silly buggers with words...
31. If Jesus had an immortal soul that did not die, and that immortal soul was Jesus, why not say that we are misinformed about Jesus dying for sinners, just the house he lived in died to save the house that men live in and the real Jesus did not die, and the real man is not saved?
Begging the question, don't care about the answer anyway.
32.When Jesus rasied Lazarus of Bethany from the dead, where did Lazarus come from?
Where he came from before. What, did bringing him back from the dead suddenly make him Italian or something? Silly answer to silly question...
33. If the real Lazarus had been in Heaven for four days, and then came back to live with his sisters again, can you explain why he never told them a word about his wonderful trip and what he saw up there?
Begging the question, don't care about the answer anyway.
I have one question; why can't anyone prove god exists? The arguement that you shouldn't be able to is acceptable if expanded on fully.
People living in glass paradigms shouldn't throw stones...
Nicely done, Frenchy and Abaddon.
Taxi for Yadirf!
Englishman.
Truth exists;only falsehood has to be invented. -Georges Braque
Sister Rossetta answers all my Biblical questions these days.
Ginny, wondering if Yadirf wears boxers or briefs . . . I bet Lilacs knows!
Dear Sister Rossetta,
We are several concerned, God fearing men, who need your enlightenment on a subject that most men have to deal with. Does Satan use a man's underwear choice against him? The debate between boxers or briefs is just too confusing, and we were seeking your advice as to which should be worn, to protect the family jewels from the burning flames of hell. Also, what about thongs and g-strings, are those bad too, because the women really like them, or should we just go freestyle, the way we were born?
Thanks,
The Fraternal Order of Buttmonkeys
-----
Dear Fraternal Order of Buttmonkeys:
Deceived Christians think that Jesus will allow them through the pearly gates regardless of the underwear they choose. Not so! The Bible Clearly States that to guarantee admittance into heaven, men's underwear must go up to the neck, down to the wrists, and down to the ankles!
Today's stubborn generation ignores that sweet promise in exchange for vanity and comfort. Men are left to choose between boxers and briefs.
Some gamble their salvation on the garment that covers the most skin--the boxer. But only a hedonist could endure the free-swinging movement that boxers allow! God's verdict is clear: You must wear "Tighty-Whities."
The Bible Clearly States you are forbidden to "go commando" or "free-style." That's a sin! And any woman who suggests you wear a thong or g-string is a strumpet and a whore! God has spoken.
Sister Rossetta
Caution: Of late, satanic hybrid undergarments called boxer-briefs have become popular in the secular world. Don't be fooled! If you wear them, you'll go straight to Hell as surely as all those models for Abercrombie, Structure, and Calvin Klein!
Such questions are of the "how many angels fit on the head of a pin" type.
Far more substantial questions get to the heart of Christianity, and on these JWs fail miserably to measure up.
Perhaps most substantial of all in the JW world is to ask this: Does God require Christians to obey a small group of men who claim to speak exclusively for him but who have demonstrated that they often speak nonsense in God's name?
AlanF
Frenchy & Abaddon,
Great job!
Very interesting reading, thank you!
puffs
40 Bars.
Two words that I was thinking of when I read some of the quesitons is:
Ambiguity.......Semantics.
ashi
yadirf-
im dissapointed, this is by far the most ridiculous excuse for a wt defense ive seen you post to date.
chuckd said:
I don't mean to imply that it is something you made up, but I wonder if it may have a bit of Urban Legend to it.chuck wont come out and accuse this story of being made up, well, ill do the honors. if you didnt make it up, someone else did, which is why, i assume, that you havent responded to anyone on this thread as of yet, and why im pretty sure you can post no evidence of said event.
if it were true, or rather, if it is true, its hard to believe that the society would be so ignorant as to put up these 33 questions as a prerequisite to a debate. what would the answers prove about the debater?
what marvelous feces you provide us with yadirf, you were putting up better arguments when you were silent.
aa
Friday: So, the Society supposedly asked these 33 questions to Moody and they couldn't answer them. Kinda reminds me of you, Friday. How many times have people here asked you questions that you could not answer, so you just ignored their questions? Many times.
