4 Employment Openings 4 Ex-dubs

by Mindchild 25 Replies latest jw friends

  • mommy
    mommy

    Hey Skipper
    I will have to insist that we do have a Jim on the island. And we have lots of cyanide laced kool-aid. And ummm machine guns and a plane and umm group sex. Yep that about does it for my requirements. BTW do I have to apply?

    To all
    This plan of moving to an island is closer to reality than Armegeddon. The joint effort of several of us together can actually lay the groundwork for perhaps more islands to be purchased and others the financial freedom of living and retiring there. Not to mention that there will be plenty of room for those who want to take their vacation there. What a backdrop for an Aposatofest huh?

    I have been very lucky to be privy to the more in depth plans of this project and it is feasible! We together can make this happen. Who would not want to work hard for a year, then have the rest of your life "off" or if you would prefer in a semi retired state, to ease the boredom of paradise. Of course there are other means of making money besides the traditional timeclock. Skipper has well layed out, tested and true methods for doing this and he is willing to share them with others of like mind.

    Please take a look at the links. See if living on an island is really something that you want, and can live with. Also the relocation to Florida will be eased by having ones who already live there to basically set up shop for you until you arrive. I personnally am 100% this project and am more than willing to put all my energy into this until we reach our goal.

    If you are too embarrassed to post here on the board, please email Skipper or myself. I have already contacted a few of you and would love to hear from others.
    wendy(Bermuda, Bahamas, come on pretty mama, Key Largo, Montego, Baby why don't we go)

  • mommy
    mommy

    Prisca,
    You asked:

    Who has the final say on things on this island?[/red][/b] Say the vote is 50-50 on an issue, what happens then?

    Hopefully we will work out most issues before we even get there. By carefully planning and deciding who will work well together, we will be able to avoid a possible tragic conflict. We are actually working on a plan that we can all get to know each other better and see if in reality we can live together. There are basic requirements for living here and the ability to get along with others and solve problems as an adult is a prerequisite.

    Of course there will be problems that arise and living together on a confined space(20-30 acres) would require everyone to bend a bit in their own expectations. But as I said, we would love to have all interested apply. And then we can take it from there as to who will actually be "approved."
    wendy

    When I leave, you will know I have been here

  • Celtic
    Celtic

    In backup of Mindchild and Mommy, I too fully endorse these plans. From conversations with Mindchild, who's head seems very much switched on, he is not after some other agenda, he has no other motive, but to enable the living standards of other individuals. Having looked into the matter thusfar, I am behind him all the way and will offer him whatever support and hard work that is required to bring this dream into focus.

    If the 'blind' cannot see the opportunity here proffered, then I urge you to once again, open your mind a bit more, take off your blinkers, and have the willingness to put in, for whatever you put into life, by equal measure will be whatever you want out of it. It comes down to the fact, have you got that kind of positive attitude and enthusiasm for getting along with others?

    Taking my hat off to Mindchild and Mommy, thankyou for your inspiration!!

    Kindest regards

    Mark

  • ballistic
    ballistic

    It does sound great, but I'm also wrong side of the pond and I do already live on a kind of island LOL. Sorry.

  • expatbrit
    expatbrit

    Mindchild:

    I've read your threads on this project with considerable bemusement, particularly relating to the part about purchasing an island in the Archipielago de las Perlas (Pearl Islands) and developing it as a form of idyllic community.

    Co-incidentally, Panama is on my travel list for the medium-term, so I started some basic research on the country a short while ago. I firmly believe in being as fully prepared as possible before travelling somewhere (let alone living there), and this involves taking a brutally realistic view of places, their shortcomings, and their hazards. Being in an unexpected and unsupported situation in a foreign place is not an adventure, it is a frightening crisis. Consequently, I hope that you are taking a more realistic view of this place than is implied in your threads, where the project participants use terms such as "paradise" etc. There is no such thing as paradise; there is no utopia. Invariably, no matter how wonderful a place appears, there is always a leper behind the palm tree.

    Here are a few of the most basic thoughts, questions and observations which I personally feel need to be soberly considered.

    Immigration matters

    If you intend to live in Panamanian territory you will presumably be required to go through Panamanian immigration procedures. Have you researched these? What requirements does Panama have for accepting immigrants in terms of desirability in occupations, wealth etc? Will your project participants qualify? What requirements does Panama have for education and raising of children etc? Do any of you speak Spanish? Are you temperamentally suited to living in a foreign country and culture?

    The Island

    Have you, or any participants, visited these islands to carry out a preliminary survey? From your previous threads, it seems that the island you will purchase requires infrastructure development. Who will carry out these developments? How will you control the development, since this will need to be accomplished before you move to the island? Quality of life is substantially less in Panama than the U.S. Is it even possible to develop infrastructure to an acceptable level for people used to living in the U.S.? How much will all this cost? How will infrastructure be maintained?

    Climate

    The Pearl Islands are located approx. 8.5 degrees N of the equator (in comparison, Miama is 25 degrees N). To put it bluntly, the sun at those latitudes is brutal. For most of the year, the UV index is rated as extreme (10+), and unprotected skin (particularly light skin) will begin to burn in approximately 10-15 minutes of exposure. In fact, it's quite interesting to put on sunblock, and then watch as the red stripes and patches form on your skin where you've missed bits. Running around in a bikini is the last thing you want to be thinking of doing (your chest hair wouldn't suit a bikini anyway). Temperatures are generally in the 90 to 100 degree F range. The high humidity will make it "feel like" 5 to 10 degrees F hotter. Not pleasant, even for lying on the beach, let alone working and maintaining an island.

    Health

    Healthcare is not at the high level of the U.S. What facilities will you have on the island, for everything from minor fractures to serious injuries, or childbirth arrangements etc? How will you get quickly to medical help, if it is needed? According to the U.S. embassy in Panama:

    Although Panama City has some very good hospitals and clinics, medical facilities outside of the capital are limited.

    Realistically, while you live on the island, you will have to make trips to the mainland. Panama is a tropical developing country, with the expected diseases.

    Malaria exists in some parts of Panama. Cases of dengue fever are increasing particularly but not only in rural areas. Visitors are advised to cover up and use insect repellent. There was a recent outbreak of a pulmonary viral infection (hantavirus, spread by rats) in the Central Provinces of Herrar and Los Santos, though it appears to have been successfully contained. - UK Foreign Office
    Safety and the political situation

    Central and Northern South America are not exactly stable areas politically. The situation in Panama has deteriorated since the departure of the U.S. military from the canal zone in 1999. In addition, Panama borders Colombia.

    From the U.S. embassy in Panama:

    Travel toward Colombia beyond a line drawn from Punta Carreto in the Comarca de San Blas Province on the Atlantic coast, through Yaviza in the eastern Darien Province, to Punta Pina on the Pacific coast, may be dangerous due to the activities of drug traffickers, Colombian guerrillas, and Colombian paramilitary groups. This area encompasses parts of the Darien National Park, as well as privately-owned nature reserves and tourist resorts. While no incidents have occurred at these resorts, Colombian groups in the Darien have perpetrated kidnappings of residents and tourists. The potential for violence against Americans exists.
    From the UK Foreign Office:

    Travel to the Darien province should be conducted only with an organised group and to recognised tourist destinations. The border area with Colombia is particularly dangerous and political and criminal violence in Colombia often spills over into Panama. There have been recent incursions by Colombian guerrillas and other armed groups. Two Europeans were kidnapped and killed on the border in March 1997 and two British nationals were held captive for 9 months before being released on the Colombian side of the border in December 2000.
    Again, you are living on an island. But realistically, you will be dependent upon necessities from the mainland, including food and water. A check of the map ( http://www.latinsynergy.org/panamamap.htm) shows that the Pearl Islands are located approximately 75 miles from the destabilised zone of Darien Province and 100 miles from the Colombian border. This is too close for comfort. What will you do if the adjacent mainland becomes unstable? Worst case scenario? An island of defenceless Americans makes for awfully good hostage material.

    In addition, according to the US embassy:

    With the 1999 departure of the U.S. military from Panama, local maritime search and rescue capabilities are greatly diminished.

    Finally, Panamanian waters are a central highway for drugs shipments North.

    These are basic but important considerations, even leaving aside completely the feasibility of conducting any business enterprises from the island.

    I sincerely hope you are considering this enterprise realistically, and not allowing visions of mythical tropical paradises or utopian societies to cloud your judgement. Failure in an enterprise such as this will at the best be traumatic, at the the worst extremely dangerous. Please be careful!

    Expatbrit

    References:

    Map of Panama: http://www.latinsynergy.org/panamamap.htm

    UK Foreign Office advice for travellers: Panama: http://www.fco.gov.uk/travel/countryadvice.asp?PN

    US Embassy, consular information sheet: http://travel.state.gov/panama.html

    Expatbrit

  • OUTLAW
    OUTLAW

    HA-HA!Hey Skipper,does that brain of yours ever stop?)LOL)I think your a good hearted person,I hope you pull this off...OUTLAW

  • Celtic
    Celtic

    Expatbrit

    Whilst this is not my post, I hope you don't mind me being honest in my answers to you too.

    You mention that it is wise to be brutally honest in such matters, now I prefer the word, ruthless, but at the same time I am not so unrealistic to weigh up these considerations you make against such action, I believe in balance if one views this reflexively, there is a very good chance of pulling this off. I guess it comes down to how negatively you like to view things, usually this viewpoint attached, unknowingly to the participant, originates on the part of laziness to oneself.

    On the other hand or flip side of the coin, whilst positive outlook people are well aware of the difficulties, this does not imply naievity on our part within the pro-active thinking process. Quite the opposite in fact, we like to take a helicopter mind view of the entire balance, to see through the barriers and obstacles that much more effectively.

    Hell, whatever, you live you die, whats the difference? Just the space in between and what you personally decide to do with the total sum resources at hand.

    Study permaculture Expatbrit, that'll answer many more of your questions.

    Disease, so what? (ruthlessly realistic view). Shit happens everywhere.

    Why are you in Canada btw, and not in the UK, was the grass greener on the other side?

    Lots of peace

    Mark

  • Mindchild
    Mindchild

    Hi Expatbrit, thanks for sharing some information with us. I can understand and appreciate your concerns. Fortunately I have extensively investigated both Panama and the Pearl islands. In fact, I have friends that live in Panama and are able to give me first hand information that goes beyond the hype often seen in travel sites, etc.

    I also have hands on experience in the 2nd passport industry, immigration matters and so forth, and can assure you that it is much easier getting into Panama than either into the USA or the UK, any part of Europe etc. I plan to put the information I already have into posts on my own website regarding the immigration strategies, etc. but I see no area there for concern at all.

    Regarding the infrastructure development. For about two years I have worked with the Living Universe Foundation which has many top notch enviornmental and constructrion engineers and have learned what works and what doesn't, how to get the best deals on solar power systems, and so forth. While costs are certainly a consideration, it is one of the factors that makes this a joint effort instead of an individual effort. There is always advantages in sharing resources this way.

    I have also done a lot of research on the climate and in our website you can check the links to find that the climate on the Pacific side where these islands are located is far more tolerable than the climate on the Caribbean side. The average temperature is about 80 degrees f. because of the ocean and the breezes. There are some hot days just as everywhere else but it is a much milder climate than even Florida in the summertime, regardless of its proximity to the equator.

    The health care issue has also been investigated. There is a new hospital that was built about a year ago that is about ten minutes travel time away. The health care in nearby Costa Rica exceeds the USA in some areas and offers costs about one third of what the USA has. In Panama you can also find excellent health care with American trained doctors. In fact there are several U.S. owned and operated medical schools in Panama. If you didn't know already, Wendy is a registered nurse, so we have someone very competent for the island already.

    Regarding the political stablity, your source made some very sweeping genralizations that are not currently applicable. Panama is actually quite stable in terms of the government, uses the American dollar for currency, has a strong business and banking system and has got rid of the biggest trouble maker around. Nearby Costa Rica is an outstanding example of a democratically stable government that doesn't even have an army. Columbia is certainly unstable but this area is well developed in the recreational and tourist industry and the surrounding islands are populated with resorts. This is not an area that drug smugglers use for any of their business and is much safer than any major American city. I have an extensive background in security prior to getting invloved in the book business and one of the big appeals of this area is the security. Compare this with islands that can be purchased for a fraction of the price up north in Honduras or Nicaragua where there is much more instablity. The government of Panama is making serious efforts to draw both tourists and expatriates into Panama and has implemented a $40,000,000 program to even offer home loans and business loans to Americans moving into their country. There are very generous tax laws in place giving a 10 year tax holiday to new busineses and so forth. This doesn't sound to me like a government that is in chaos but one who knows which side of the bread the butter is on. As a result, they are going to protect the areas where tourism is a income generating area. It is just self interest on their part but at least you can count on it.

    We haven't purchased the island yet, that remains something that will happen months down the road. There are several opportunities to buy nice private islands around the world. Panama has a lot going for it in terms of location, stability, climate, safety (no hurricanes in this area) and costs. But there are islands for sale all the way from Europe to Fiji. We will make the best determination at the time of what loaction fits our resources and is the most desireable. For the moment, the Pearl Islands do that.

    Finally, we recognize that there are always challenges and Murphy's Laws to contend with. Nobody has ever handed me anything on a silver platter and I've had to work my butt off for things. Probably won't be much different here either. There is no utopian ideals here or secret social experiments. This is just a group of smart people who are looking for a better life without all the negatives they already face with crime, high taxes, lousy climate, traffic, pollution, earthquakes, hurricanes, and those damn Jehovah's Witnesses knocking on their door. On our island, if they ever show up, we will have them for dinner.

    Skipper

  • expatbrit
    expatbrit

    Celt:

    I consider someone being honest and straightforward with me to be a compliment.

    Whether or not I'm lazy I've never really considered. On the plus side, I arrived in Canada with $300 and now run my own business with employees, so I'm gonna be kind to myself in that area of judgement!

    Taking the helicopter view (seeing the big picture) is relative, of course. With this kind of thing everyone does their own risk/benefit analyses and reaches their own conclusion. The point of my post then, is not to be negative or critical. Rather, the people who up to this point I know are involved are people I like and would like to consider as friends. Thus, it would be a failure on my part not to tell my concerns.

    Finally, I haven't studied permaculture, but being in Canada, I do know about permafrost!(does that count?) I'm here rather than the UK because my wife is Canadian, and in the choice of who went where, I seized the opportunity for travel. Haven't regretted it, though I do miss old blighty considerably sometimes.

    Expatbrit

  • expatbrit
    expatbrit

    Mindchild:

    I'm glad you have experience in so many relevant areas, and have researched this thoroughly, and have some first-person sources of the area. My sources I don't consider to be hyped-up, though they do have to try and give useful information to travellers while discouraging dummies from doing dumb things.

    As mentioned to Celtic, the point of my post was not to be discouraging or negative, but rather to state my concerns on what may happen, likely or not.

    In which case, now I've done that, it simply remains for me to wish you luck and success! Should you have JW's for dinner, remember to bleed them properly first.

    Expatbrit

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