I was just thinking today at work about the whole NGO thing and got pretty deep in thought about it. I remember reading about it and I remember reading on a pro JW site I think it was Jehovah uk or something like that. On the pro JW site they said that when the society signed and joined as an NGO there were no requirements to pledge that you will uphold the ideals of the UN etc etc. Ok I get that, they may not have made allegiances to the UN in any way whatsoever and the UN probably did change the NGO policy at a later date making new members agree to uphold the ideals of the UN. But what bothered me is that why would they want ANYTHING to do with the UN that they excessively demonized on so many occasions? I remember how the UN was made to be such a filthy counterfeit to Gods Kingdom. I remember how in the Revelation study book it made the UN something disgusting and something to be treated with utter contempt. Why would you have anything to do with something that you demonized so? No matter if it was just for the library or whatever. Even if you made no allegiances whatsoever to them. I wouldn't have anything to do with something I thought as an abomonation and disgusting on any level not just make sure I don't alliance myself to it's ideals not even touching it with a 10 foot pole.
The whole NGO thing.
by shakyground 36 Replies latest jw friends
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TMS
Yes, shaky. It's hypocritical, indefensible from a doctrinal standpoint. Think about how the same organization views such things as joining a YMCA or working for a company that is a defense subcontractor. Years ago an elderly sister was seen through the window at a Christian Science reading room. She was approached about it and stated that she couldn't see the conflict. She viewed it as a library close to her home. She was eventually DF'd for this very thing.
"Quit touching the unclean thing!" they tell us. lol!
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Band on the Run
The issue isn't whether they had to obey UN Law, treaties, or principles. The WTBTS preached against the UN most vehemently for years. I would constantly go on tours as a kid. I dreamed of being a tour lady when I grew up. Languages got in the way. My friend worked there as a UN civil servant. People were so friendly and nice. There were no marked beasts roaming around, just a nice garden and 50s great furniture.
The mere act of filling out a form gives the UN legitimacy from the Witnesses. I don't think a German kid who was a JW could join Hitler Youth. No way. It is doing business with what they said was the devil, Satan. Why would a Society that spent untold hours of many, many people and spent many, many printed pages acknowledge such an organization. What benefit could possibly outweight the moral crime?
This is not a religion that any notion of Jesus' social gospel. They say they are restorationist. The early Christians, as reported early in Acts, practiced communism. Peter killed a couple with a Holy Spirit zap. Can you imagine how many billions the Witnesses would zap? This is the religion that makes no provisions for its own members who have no food, housing, or sanitation. The world is so bad but where would Witnesses be without our Satanic worldly safety net. Not everyone can drive around in limousines like Bethelites. Some Bethelites.
Shame on them. No one would think much of an ngo status were it not for the melodramatic haranguing by Witnesses. If you saw the pretty tour guides who were very attractive, the UN would not seem so bad.
My friend had very amusing stories there. No one knew Dynasty or Dallas at the UN. When Reagan was shot, professional workers stood on their desks and cheered throughout several buildings. No one was fired. The Tower of Babel. Oh, the WTC and the Tower of Babel. It drives me crazy.
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Black Sheep
Yes. You are correct.
But ....
Ok I get that, they may not have made allegiances to the UN in any way whatsoever and the UN probably did change the NGO policy at a later date making new members agree to uphold the ideals of the UN.
Anyone who proposes this should be challenged to produce evidence. They won't. There isn't any. If there was, they would have produced it and made a statement, rather than speculating using "may" and "probably".
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Band on the Run
Sorry but I am reved up here. As far as I'm aware, the Society has never issued a statement or given a press conference where they acknowledged that altho the action was moral, it had the appearance of impropiety. Can't they just say we're a human and we err. It was a poor judgment call, giving a false impression when our actual policy is correct. It is regrettable. We've learn from this lesson. As we go forward, we will be more careful how our actions can be misconstrued.
I had no clue it happened. My eyes bugged out when I saw the posts.
Also, what benefits did the WTS receive for this bargain? It's a bargain, the best I've ever had....WHO fan
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rebel8
They did sign a pledge, which involved not only agreeing with UN principles, but including supportive statements in their publications and attending UN events to promote UN-related shared goals, which they also did. For years.
They didn't get rid of their registered NGO status in the US until they got caught.
After that, the wts in other countries continued/continues to remain registered as an NGO and has set up and staffed information tables at UN events.
And lied about it.
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Mad Sweeney
I recall having actually seen the early documents when they first signed up - that did not include the pledge language, but it was only after a couple years that the forms DID include the pledge language. Yet, they remained members. It was ONLY when they were caught and it went public that they withdrew membership. Even still, they participate in NGO activities and conferences to this day.
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willyloman
If you think the WTS misunderstood its obligation to support the UN, then how can you explain all those Awake articles that appeared during that time lauding the UN's work ... articles in which the standard last paragraph was conspicuous by its absence? I refer to the boilerplate final paragraph the WTS had always included in any other article that portrayed well-meaning efforts on the part of worldly people to make this earth a better place to live. You remember. It usually said something like, "Of course, only God's Kingdom can really make a difference, etc."
The Awake articles on the UN during that period looked like PR pieces, always lacking the condemnatory final paragraph. But they did fulfill the Society's pledge to promote the work of the world organization to which the WTS willingly belonged.
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Mad Sweeney
You make a great point, willyloman. The fact that the pledge to support UN programs didn't appear on UN forms for the first year or two of their membership is really a red herring (I just wanted to clarify the facts as I've seen them, not to imply that the WT misunderstood its obligation). The September 8, 1991 Awake! featured MAJOR ass-kissing of the UN. Blondie posted the entire text of the article here:
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Band on the Run
I am stunned to read that the Awake! would report glowng UN articles. All I ever read in the 60s and early 1970s was very heavy duty UN is evil, all evil. The UN part of the bargain is clear but I don't see what the Witnesses gained. Perhaps some world respectability. Does anyone know if there was any activity besides filling out a form. The UN was one of reasons Armageddon was so near in 1975.
The Massacre of the French Hungenots, the Bubonic Plague, other reigns of terror were nothing. The fall of the Roman Empire was nothing. In fact, the Holocaust was nothing. The UN was a chief component of their eschatology.
I am very curious as to how this was made public. Was it an inside job by an apostate?
I think I should get a job writing bs for them.