An Old Argument.... does it hold water? (page 2)

sabastious

Your view? Please share. Try and stick to the point.

Since we do not know whether consciousness continues on after death we are, in turn, unaware of where those children go. I think it's safe to assume that, currently, no one on Earth has the capability of surpassing all the obstacles in the way of saving those children. You have an assumption that the Creator of the humans has this capability. You are also assuming there are no substantial unknown obstacles.

The answer to why does "God" permit suffering: a) He/It/They don't have the capability to change human destiny b) are aware of facts about the universe that human's are unaware of and therefore should be trusted, by necessity, on that superiority

-Sab

PSacramento

Estimates range from 4 million to 15 million children die from starvation each year on this planet. That's between 500 and 1700 children a day, depending on what numbers you accept. Still, no matter which numbers you use, doesn't this make you arrive at one of the following conclusions

All those studes also show that WE can eradciate hunger and the vast majority of infant deaths ( with proper medical treatments that are available) but instead we spend billions on wars and wast billions of tons of foof and medicine.

We can indeed blame God for not doing soemthing about that, or blame ourselves.

Always easier to blame others.

Genesis tells us that we are stewards of creation, which means WE are responsible for it ALL.

Don't beleive in Genesis or God? fine.

Evolutuonary morals tells us that if we CAN help others that we OUGHT to, correct?

Well then?

Should we still blame God or accuse God of being evil because he doesn't help when we KNOW He can?

That is a valid question.

If we are to have freewill then we must be free to DO what God created us for - stewards of creation OR be free to NOT do it.

If God intervenes and dicates then we are NOT free to choose and we have been obsolved of the responsibility of our actions ( since we can fix things and we don't, since it was because of Us that people suffer and die when we do nothing to help them, then it is our responsibility).

I know that it woudl be easier for us for God to fix all the mess we do, but that wouldn't be right now would it?

Does this make the fact that children die everyday any easier?

No, but we also KNOW that the money spent to wage war for 1 month can probably feed all the children that die of hunger every day for a whole year.

God MAY be accountable, yes, BUT WE ARE FOR SURE !

Found Sheep

I don't know always had a hard time falling for the JW reason for why bad things happen to good people, or any child.....

Why would he fix some problems and not others???

sabastious

This comes up anytime any religion teaches that a "miracle" occurred to save someone's life when thousands just like that person died in identical circumstances.

God is impartial. Personal revelation should only be noted in the historical archive rather than be used start whole movements of "chosen ones."

-Sab

N.drew

No, not fixing, p r e v e n t ing. There is a power we all have in common. That is what needs taming. Some will refuse to have it tamed. And funny as it is, it is the same one that would complain. Weird huh?

james_woods

*That last sentence is not Nancy saying, OK?

Perfectly OK with me, Nancy - as I doubt that myself or anybody else has the slightest idea what you are talking about.

agonus

I think it may be a mistake to assume that the kind of force we would normally refer to as "God" is necessarily omnipotent. Like Einstein and Spinoza, I believe in a higher power that may not be a "personal" God in the traditonal sense, but, like all great mysteries of the universe, it's definitely out there in some form, and we would do well to respect and be humbled by it but not be too hasty to jump to conclusions, make assumptions about its nature, or formulate dogmatic opinions as to what "it" is all about.

ShadesofGrey

I know what you mean Nancy.

I personally have no answer to the OP, unless JWs had this one thing right. But babies, what do suffering babies prove? :( I still don't really get it.

Twitch

Well said, Agonus & Sab

N.drew

There will be those who will lay vague claims like: "Well, God's plan is better than ours." "God knows best, and since he is superior to us in understanding, it will all work out for the best."

It won't work out for the best unless the people cooperate. Not by becoming mindless. Not by becoming the same. Not by only "believing". How then? You're asking me?

My theory is the power of the reflection of God (that of course is weaker than God's power) needs to be channeled to good, not bad.

We do not want to do away with sin, because we might want to sin, later. Do you understand? If we set up judgement against sin we might be sorry. You, me, them starving babies, everyone.

That is why the dedication is valid. Not the dedication to a society, but the promise made to God. It has everything to do with TRUST.

Only when we trust God the Father can we do away with pain and suffering.

"The lawless one" will not succumb. That is why the wicken one needs to be removed, if the wicked one keeps on resisting. That is what the time is for. Everyone needs to agree. I believe it must be unanimous because of what we have in common. It is not God, it is power. God will have us own the power, but, I think it is obvious, not now. Is it not obvious?

An Old Argument.... does it hold water?

Share this