JW Apologists, Lurkers, etc., can you prove the selection in 1919?

garyneal

I mean, this is the pivotal doctrine that will prove beyond all shadow of a doubt that this religion really is the one true religion.

Why is this so?

Why not just read and study the Bible and see that the witnesses adhere to it and therefore must be the one true religion?

Because a lot of what the witnesses say that Bible says is merely their interpretation of the Bible from my point of view. Want to prove the Trinity false, well there are verses that can be plucked to argue this. Want to prove that Jesus is Michael the Archangel? Well, simply refer to the verse that says that Jesus came with a shout and the voice of an archangel (while conveniently ignoring the part that says that He also had the trumpet of God). Interpretation, plain and simple.

What about the fact that the Trinity is hard to understand and therefore must be false? Well, the overlapping generation doctrine is also hard to understand, is it also false? If understanding the recent new light on the generation teaching requires special insight that we poor outsiders do not have, how can the same thing not be said of the Trinity? Interpretation, plain and simple.

Please guys, I beg you, please show me the proof that the Watchtower Society has the correct interpretations and the true teachings. How can I tell if indeed they are indeed being guided by God to provide the proper spiritual food as opposed to my reading the Bible and drawing my own conclusions. How come my interpretations are invalid whereas their interpretations are the Truth?

Experience? Okay, I suppose. But what about all the pastor's of other churches? What about the teachings of the Eastern Orthodox, Anglican, Catholic, Apostolic, and other Christian sects? If some of their teachings do not line up with scripture, they're false. But if some of your teachings do not line up with scripture, that's okay?

Truth is, with so much being open to interpretation, how can anyone really be sure if any sect is right? Ah, but according to my research, the Watchtower was actually selected by Christ in 1919. Evidently, this gives them the authority to proclaim that they have the true teachings. All I ask is for the proof, surely this would be simple to do, right?

You have the information, you have access to the Kingdom Hall libraries which I, as an outsider, do not. Surely this would be a simple task for you would it not? If someone could provide irrefutable proof then I would suit up and go door to door proclaiming the kingdom message. I would shout it from the rooftops. "I am a Jehovah's Witness and the Watchtower was truly chosen by Jesus Christ in 1919. The proof is right here!" I would denounce the holidays as pagan and unclean and refuse blood for me and my family because the slave said so. I may not understand it, but the slave is right, how do I know? Because the slave was chosen by Christ Jesus in 1919 and here is the proof!

Seriously, this is not a joke and I am not trying to bait anyone. I am genuinely seeking this but I have not been able to find it on my own. If this really is the one true religion, I'd hate to think that I was rejecting it and wind up condemned by God because I was unable to find this information.

OnTheWayOut

Your title question is the whole premise of the most excellent book, CAPTIVES OF A CONCEPT.

Google it and get a download copy. It's amazingly simple to understand considering the depth of that topic.

N.drew

They want to be of service to god, and it seems the JWs are the best fit. What other religion tells you what to say and where to go?

They can't prove those men were selected in 1919 and they can't prove they are the faithful and discrete slave . They don't even understand the difference between a question ("who is the f&ds") and a declaration (love Jehovah with your whole heart). It doesn't say obey the men appointed by Jah with your whole heart. I've read the whole Bible. It doesn't say that.

garyneal

Thanks, OTWO.

Frankly, I have been having these conversations with my wife on this very topic. She does nothing to provide the proof and instead becomes argumentative and says that I do not have the right 'heart condition.' Of course, she also says that only Jehovah knows the heart so how can she know whether or not I have the right heart condition?

I am dead serious on this topic. My wife has not be willing to try to prove this one to me. I am planning to ask Brother Hero this tomorrow during our study, I hope he is more willing to provide the answers than my wife is. During our studies, he pointed out the scripture where Paul preached the good news so that irregardless of what the people did with the message, Paul would not be responsible for their blood on his hands. By my wife's resistance to reason on this topic (while turning the attention to my character) would not my blood be on her hands for not providing this life saving piece of information?

She reasons that even if she gave me the proof, I would still ultimately leave the religion due to my own selfish desires. How does she know this? Even if this were true, would I not be held accountable to Jehovah alone for this? At least my blood would not be on her hands, right?

Soooooooo, can any believing Jehovah's Witness here answer this? I really want to know.

garyneal

I've read the whole Bible. It doesn't say that.

Ah, but a witness will disagree with that statement because according to the Watchtower there was always a governing body appointed by God since the days of Moses. How do I know this? Because the slave said so. However, who's to say that the slave was right in this interpretation of scripture? Evidently, it was Jesus in 1919. Surely there is proof of this somewhere but I cannot seem to find it.

N.drew

John 5:31,32 Jesus is saying "if I bear witness concerning myself my witness is not true, but there is one who bears witness about me".

It was 1. John 2. prophesy fullfilled 3. powerful works 4. holy spirit 5. many testimonies other than John's 6. expectation realized 7. knowledge of heavenly things, all these bear witness to Jesus. Revelation says listen to him. The Bible never says listen to an organization. But the only evidence the founders of the religion of Jehovah's Witnesses have is their own. They bear witness of themselves.

The Bible has no precedent to point to that someone can appoint one's self to lead God's people. And if Jesus did choose someone, we would know, it wouldn't be a question.

They say look at the love it is enough evidence. The love the witnesses show testifies to the truth that man is made in God's image. It does not prove they are selected.

garyneal

N Drew,

According to the Bible, Jesus did many things to prove His claims to authority just as you stated. According to the Bible, even Moses did miraculous things to prove that he had God's backing.

According to the Watchtower, their authority came from the selection by Jesus Christ in 1919. Can any believing Jehovah's Witness point to anything that irrefutably proves this?

N.drew

We who are 100% confident that The Heavenly Father is real can't prove it.

How can anyone prove that a spirit talked to them and assigned them the world?

No. How can anyone prove that a spirit assigned the world to men who are now dead?

"Can any believing Jehovah's Witness point to anything that irrefutably proves this?"

Of course there is no one who can.

garyneal

We who are 100% confident that The Heavenly Father is real can't prove it.

This is true so it logically follows that:

Believers in God cannot prove He is real.
Bible believers cannot prove it is inspired.

Given those two facts, how can anyone prove any religion is true?

wobble

I think you are in danger of being sidetracked from your title question Gary.

If I claimed that God chose me for a particular role in say , 1962, I could not play you a recording of his voice telling me, so I would have to offer different evidence, if I wanted you to follow me, trust me, believe my interpretation of scripture, and remain loyal to me etc etc

If I claimed to be "God's channel of communication" I would point to all the correct directives on matters I had given you since 1962, all the correct biblical interpretations of prophecy since 1962, all the good works I had done in looking after things that would be expected of me in the God appointed role.

In particular, I would point to one unique doctrine that I was teaching, in 1962, that proved my claim for that year, nothing less would do, later teachings and works have no bearing on that year.

This evidence would be good enough to convince a Court of Law and would withstand any scrutiny.

I am sure Bro Hero will be able to do this for his claim of the 1919 choosing of the Bible Students.

Let us know his evidence so we can put trust in that claim too !

JW Apologists, Lurkers, etc., can you prove the selection in 1919?

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