"For my own sake" means I get something. I do not like to be alone and I do not like to be insulted so, what do you think I get snare? What in the world do I get? Embarrased? Oh Yah!!!
Christian Atheists, why did you throw the baby out with the bath water?
by Elsewhere 86 Replies latest jw friends
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tec
I supppose I could choose individual culture heroes---explain the complex mythology around them---
Or just name a couple. I can do the research myself.
but the point was that you did not hesitate to suggest that these people were worshipping only in partial truth, or that they had left this true god---without having any details.
Normally, I don't comment on the faith of another person. Regardless of what it is. But it is too easy to make a generalization on a general statement. I should have just left it that I could not comment without more information.
Yet you are uncomfortable conceding that their beliefs and heroes are quite complex with many powerful lessons and build a great deal of hope in their believers.
No, I'm not uncomfortable with that at all. No doubt those things are true of their believers (though I still cannot comment on any 'hero')
I find this is typical of most religions. They are willing to assume the negative points--the lack of enlightenment---but are unwilling to concede the positives without more details. In other words, they first assume the less. Then AFTER learning more about a religion, they perhaps concede that there is more to it than they had first thought. It is interesting.
Most religions are comple x , as far as I know... and rich in detail about creation/death/sometimes an afterlife/punishment/reward/commands/etc. The religion of Christianity is no different in that regard. Because religion is religion.
I also think that similar truths run within most faiths. Because some truths are universal.
Truth be known, I don't care if someone has a partial understanding, no understanding, full understanding. Their understanding is not mine to judge. I am who I am to keep an eye upon. My seeking, my faith, my knowledge (or lack of it). I guarentee that I don't have full understanding either. But Christ teaches me all I need to know, to do as He wants me to do. (not that I don't make mistakes, but I learn and seek from Him) How God dealt with other people before and of other/any faiths even now is His business.
Which only proves my point more fullly---EVERY culture believes their god is superior (or their understanding of the same god) naturally, that is what belief is all about. EVERY culture believes that others are somehow not as enlightened. EVERY culture follows a very similar pattern in beliefs, if not the beliefs themselves. And they think they have stumbled onto the purest truth.
Most do, I agree. (I say most only because some do adopt a different culture/god/faith based on the evidence of a better understanding/truth)
Just be content to know that Christianity does not encompass the majority,
Numbers do not mean anything, as far as I understand, one way or the other.
and you can be sure, that other belief systems are just as complex, nuanced, and sincere as yours.
I agreed with that above.
You don't need to assume that any group anywhere is simple or that their understanding of the world and religion is simple.
I do not. Even though I think simple is best. Simple is pure.
All humans are complicated, and they are all capable of creating culture heroes that are not watery or vague.
No doubt.
And they think you are wrong.
Or they think I'm partially wrong ;)
And their experience is much like yours--their certainty that they have been specially guided to a purer truth.
Their e x perience is their own, and not subject to judgment by me.
They know their culture heroes as well as you know yours.
Again, that is between them (though I again do not know enough of who these culture heroes are to comment). If you are speaking of someone like Mohammad, then I think he was also a prophet. Which does not mean his words cannot be twisted... as the words of Christ have also been twisted.
And certainly you are a type of atheist in their eyes.
No, probably not. I know that I don't consider any of them a type of atheist. Atheism is no belief in god/gods/creator/whatever the flavor.
They feel a bit saddened that you can't see their truths, and that you have not been set free.
You think? I don't.
Peace to you,
Tammy
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Berengaria
Good grief, are y'all still debating this? Some believe, some don't. Done?
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shamus100
Beregingilinia,
It's thread to thread to thread, the same people!
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Berengaria
Tec , that was clever. But frankly I could never debate this subject with as much fervor as the other. The other is facts. Easy to find. Some refuse. This is a matter of feeling, opinion. Unless you are trying to tell me how I feel, I generally don't think that I have any more business telling you what god or not to believe in as the JW's do.
Politics is different. It's not opinion of the unknown, there are facts.
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ziddina
Well, I'll tell y'all something...
I am DONE wasting my time with people who don't consider facts when presented with them, and who won't answer questions when put to them... [Archaeology, paleo-archaeology, paleontology, geology, paleo-biology, and so on...]
If they want to worship Middle-Eastern male misogynistic child-murdering desert gods, then more delusions to them...
[And have you noticed how many of these worshippers - the fanatical ones who "hear" voices in their own heads - are female??]
I thought that schizophrenia was a mental affliction that mostly affects the males of the species -
No offense meant, monkey!!
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tec
Tec , that was clever.
LOL... I was just playin'. I didn't realize I had jumped into a heated moment!
People are passionate about the things that matter to them. Which is all I meant by that :)
I don't think a debate between a theist and an atheist does much to change the views of the theist or the atheist. (Perhaps in best case scenario it allows some understanding on either side, a bridge so to speak... a good goal on its own.) But there are others listening too. These kinds of talks might help them with something they were questioning as well.
Peace,
Tammy