Christian Apologists - Please Watch This and Tell Us Why it is wrong?

by cantleave 834 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  sabastious

  Zid said instead of donating my brain to science when I die I should use it with science while I am alive. For one I am already doing this and second one of the key equations of all science was created by a believer. This means that to reject the idea of God entirely you have to disagree with a fundamental belief of Albert Einstein. It's not a worthless point, the champion of science believed in God. Here is the quote again:

  “Yes, you can call it that,” Einstein replied calmly. “Try and penetrate with our limited means the secrets of nature and you will find that, behind all the discernible laws and connections, there remains something subtle, intangible and inexplicable. Veneration for this force beyond anything that we can comprehend is my religion. To that extent I am, in fact, religious.”

  So, Einstein didn't believe he could speak to this force, but rather that he couldn't deny the possibility of the existence of an underlying force to all things which is a way to describe God.

  What is this force that he is speaking about? Answer the question.

  -Sab
• 

  sabastious

  Einstein never said he believed in god (please study this term), he just didn't preclude that there may be a power that is not understood, that may have started all this; which does not equate to god. To claim Einstein beliefs even remotely resemble your twisted ideas is just an insult to everyones intelligence.

  I'm sorry, but you are wrong. Likely because you don't want it to be true. The Einstein quote ends with the word religious which is a term that is connected with God. You cannot escape it, Einstein was a deist plain and simple. It wasn't supposed to be this huge point, it was supposed to be a small point of mine and was in response to Ziddina's comment about my interaction with science not anything else.

  -Sab
• 

  tootired2care

  What is this force that he is speaking about? Answer the question.

  Who knows, but it sure wasn't god.
• 

  sabastious

  Who knows, but it sure wasn't god.

  So you are saying Einstein was making a claim without evidence?

  -Sab
• 

  tootired2care

  Sab take a look at this link below it breaks it down quite well (with other quotes). He used the term religious (with a very different connotation than you asserted and the topic of this thread) in the context of his feelings of awe in the face of the mystery of the cosmos. This had nothing to do with god, but everything to do with the unlocked mysteries of the universe.

  http://atheism.about.com/od/einsteingodreligion/tp/EinsteinMysteryReligion.htm

  So you are saying Einstein was making a claim without evidence?

  I suggested no such thing.
• 

  tootired2care

  Bottom line, Einsteins positions are not on your side.
• 

  sabastious

  TT2C even if you remove the word religious from the quote what he is describing is the supernatural. He didn't say that we lacked evidence or technology he said we lacked the means to comprehend it. When he said "behind all the discernible laws and connections" he was speaking about whatever science discovers and explains that there is a mysterious force that controls it all behind the natural world. THAT IS DESCRIBING GOD. Einstein was a deist albeit maybe a closet one. Even your quotes that you provided has Einstein specifically stating he didn't believe in a personal God. He made effort to be honest about his own beliefs: DEISM.

  -Sab
• 

  sabastious

  Bottom line, Einsteins positions are not on your side.

  If Einstein were alive today he'd condemn the militant atheists for sure. He would likely sympathize with atheists in general, but he would stay true to what he actually believed which goes against atheism (maybe a better way to say it would be that he wouldn't be for atheism as the best and only path). Even Christopher Hitchens said deism is not at odds with reason because his heroes like Thomas Paine were openly deistic. Einstein may have been more quiet about it because it was likely controversial.

  -Sab
• 

  sabastious

  Bottom line, Einsteins positions are not on your side.

  You just made me five cents richer. I never said all his positions are on my side, I said that he, as in the man, would be on my team. Deists and monotheists will debate, but monotheism is not diametrically opposite to deism like it is with atheism. On that line of reasoning he is with me as a monotheist.

  Monotheism is closer to deism than atheism is to deism. This is because atheism rejects the very idea of the supernatural.

  -Sab
• 

  cantleave

  Albert Einstein is on record as saying that he did not believe in a personal God. He said:

  "It was, of course, a lie what you read about my religious convictions, a lie which is being systematically repeated. I do not believe in a personal God and I have never denied this but have expressed it clearly. If something is in me which can be called religious then it is the unbounded admiration for the structure of the world so far as our science can reveal it."

  Einstein also said:

  "I am a deeply religious nonbeliever. This is a somewhat new kind of religion. I have never imputed to Nature a purpose or a goal, or anything that could be understood as anthropomorphic. What I see in Nature is a magnificent structure that we can comprehend only very imperfectly and that must fill a thinking person with a feeling of humility. This is a genuinely religious feeling that has nothing to do with mysticism. The idea of a personal God is quite alien to me and seems even naive."