At what age do people 'wake up'? (page 3)

Fernando

Hey Splash!

You sound like you are in a relatively good place mentally and spiritually, and keeping an even keel. Congratulations. No need to freak out yourself and those around you.

No blasting from this corner since I am an idealist who found himself thinking the same things until confronted with mounting realities regarding the true nature of all religious leaders as mostly irreformable enemies of the real Jesus and the full unabridged "good news".

The lantern you speak of does actually exist, and does make the Bible come to life and plain, without the need of human interpreters. I pray that you are led to the lantern. It is a journey though, and many peripheral questions remain - only one is now free to admit one does not know all the answers.

The lantern is the full unabridged "good news" which religious leaders deeply and secretly fear, hate and hide. "Franzgate 1980" has been secretly replayed tens of thousands of times in tens of thousands of congregations over many decades. I speak from personal experience.

You may want to ask yourself "what sort of spiritual food keeps people ignorant of the good news according to Paul, Moses, Isaiah and Psalms"?

A good starting point is to find and mark all the roughly 152 occurrences of the phrase "good news" in your Bible (by means of the wt lib search facility).

If you keep praying for spiritual revelation God will crack the code for you and the Bible will suddenly open up...

It starts with two keys without which no one enters. The first is when one is granted genuine repentance (awareness of dysfunction). The second is when one is granted genuine faith (a wide opening of our spiritual eyes).

Some of the most powerful ingredients of the map are IMPUTED righteousness, IMPUTED holiness, IMPUTED sinlessness and IMPUTED sonship available to any that would accept these as "free gifts" that cannot be earned, deserved or paid for.

Personally if I were allowed to read and understand only one book of the Bible and only one topic, it would be the "good news" in the book of Romans.

perfect1

11.

I had this friend at school who was mormon. He lived up to all JW standards, being in a high control group himself, and I was sure he loved God.

He was polite, kind, funny, well-dressed. He was my first real worldly friend.

I asked my parents if he would be killed at Armageddon.

The answer was yes.

I said if they really believed God would kill him, I could not believe in God.

My mother became hysterical.

For the next five years I was forced or coerced into attending meetings and field service, ending only when I threatened suicide.

Part of why they emphasize not associating with worldly people is because sooner or later you meet someone who is a better person than you are, who you can admire and love, who definitely deserves to make it through the final smiting, but they will say cannot because they are not JW. Can you imagine an omniscient, omnipotent God being so petty ?

FTR as an elders kid I was giving solo service metg talks around age 7 or 8, so my pre teen childhood was a real wash- an exercise in making mom and dad look holier.

St George of England

I am ashamed to say I was over 60 when TTATT dawned on me! I had been 'born in' and so brainwashed and indoctrinated since birth. Regretably I am still trapped due to wife and family.

I think younger people today have far greater independance and opportunity to leave. They have information at their finger tips via the internet. If only I had the internet half a century ago! I had never even heard of Ray Franz until I came upon this site.

George

Splash

You have nothing to be ashamed of St George.

In many ways you have come farther than many ever will, and given your upbringing and lack of exposure to anything other than JWism, you have done remarkably well.

It isn't at all strange that you feel ashamed, we have been made to feel that way all our lives, even if we gave our all and everything to the Soc.

Jesus actually doesn't demand that much - he denounced the pharisees for demanding such.

Hey Fernando, I didn't mean to freak anyone out, lol!

Fernando

Hey Splash!

Sorry for the shorthand.

I was admiring your calm approach, compared to my freak out back when TTATT (The Truth About The Truth) hit me like a ton of bricks.

J. Hofer

Jesus actually doesn't demand that much - he denounced the pharisees for demanding such.

Mark 10:21 - "Go, sell what things you have and give to the poor, and you will have treasure in heaven, and come be my follower."

must be a different jesus i guess.

james_woods

Einstein left traditional (formalized) Judaism at age 12.

perfect1

dear splash,

I like many of your posts so

At the risk of getting blasted here I do actually think that Jehovah will stop what's going on. But when, as we do not have a truthful framework to determine the time we live in?

I am going to go for this here. I invite you to think outside the cult framework for just a moment. Please try.

1. What if there is no one who will stop whats going on. What if each person is personally accountable and responsible, and actually powerful. Maybe there is no God, or if there is, how likely is it that he will make an appearance. Think of all the terrible, horrific things people have done to each other, holocausts, genocides, where this God has just observed passively. And despite what the WT teaches, you could be involved doing things which have a positive impact on other peoples lives.

2. What if the time we live in is no different than any other time. We might just be more human beings living out our relatively short lives.

3. What is the truthful framework to determine the time we live in. There are truthful frameworks, there is knowlege which is geologic, anthropologic, cosmic. The Bible may or may not be truthful, but is was definitely written in a specific, ancient context. The likelihood of you ever being able to understand the intended meaning of specific verses seems tiny. Have you ever read Shakespeare . Reading Shakespeare, so much of the metaphors and jokes go over our heads because it was written five hundred years ago. Yet it is still English so with a little help we can understand Shakespeare. The Bible on the other hand, written in Hebrew, Greek, and Aramaic, is much more ancient and culturally unlike anything we can relate to in Western culture 2012. I say culturally because like all ancient holy books there is likely to be something to relate to ethically.

Recently I attended a Bat Mitzvah (Jewish coming of age for a young woman). It was the first time I had ever been in a synagogue. If you ever attend one you will see that the JWs borrowed so much from this ancient, tribal, desert religion. Imagine these nomads wandering the ancient bible lands, being targeted by other groups and believing without a doubt they are gods chosen ones. So much of the language and outlook of the JWs comes from Judaism. The fear of persecution, the sense of being uniquely chosen. Yet the modern day Jewish people I know temper this cultural heritage with a SENSE OF HUMOR, something altogether lacking in the WTBTS.

In short, splash-y, I do not want to blast you, I just want you to think outside the box, and if you are committed to the bible, dont be afraid to relate to other people and other groups who treasure the very same words you do. See how they do it. You are all carrying the same book. In fact that book only exists today because ancient Jews and ancient Christians cared enough to preserve it. Arent you curious. Curiosity is the way to wake up.

James Brown

I woke up January 1, 1976. The Watchtower Company woke me up. I was 24. They hooted and ranted that the world was going to end in Armegeddon in 1975. I didnt see any change in 76. So I decided they were full of it. And started to fade, quit pioneering, went motorcycle riding instead of going to meetings. It took till I was 31 to totally cut all ties. I havent been to a meeting since I was 31.

panhandlegirl

I started waking up in my early thirties but it took me until my late thirties to stop attending meeting and fs. Getting out into the work force and actually being around "worldly" people helped me see the world in a different light;

I guess you could say I had "new light" or like Hank Williams, "I saw the light!"

At what age do people 'wake up'?

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