can we substitute the KFC for any other fried chicken? it's not like KFC is omnipresent in every part of the world (and i honestly prefer it that way).
on a side note, i'd like the scotch and cigar day to include steaks.
Atheists and Theists... what do you want from us?
by tec 69 Replies latest jw friends
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Hortensia
Sure, discussion is all right, for those who enjoy it. I love reading the discussions until they descend into metadiscussion, which is incredibly boring.
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Xanthippe
I am an atheist tec but I don't want anything from theists. As I said on the other thread haven't those of us who have been JWs had enough of prejudice and people being rude to us about our beliefs? Just because I have stopped believing in god or religion it doesn't mean I insist everyone feels the same.
Of course all types of fundamentalism are dangerous, we all know that on this board. But I agree with tal, whatever gets you through. I don't mean that in a patronising way either because I have been through a whole range of beliefs that were right for me and got me through at the time. In the future I may change my mind and believe something else, who knows? I guess now someone is going to make that comment about not being so open-minded that my brain falls out!
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cofty
I was very encouraged to read a helpful response to my post from AGuest - thank you
On the other hand atheist Talesin takes the award for the least helpful reply complete with insulting pictures.
If I made it sound as if all atheists were not angry, I take it back - it was a generalisation as Talesin demonstrated so well.
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PSacramento
I think that in the end, all everyone wants is respect and dignity as was mentioned before.
I don't expect people to agree with MY POV, but I would like it to be respected and, if possible, understood.
I don't agree with atheisim, but I understand it and respect it and (most) people that are atheist and for the most part, I get the back from most atheists.
That there are crude and volitile athiest is a fact, just like their are crude and volatile Theists
In that, we are all human.
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THE GLADIATOR
palmtree67 "Like others, I've looked at Tec and Shelby's new site, and I find (personally), no one questions, no one challenges. Shelby says she got a "vision", everyone praises it. As Sab said, they accept it is a "FACT" that Shelby talks to God, .......I'm sorry.....I just need more evidence. I haven't seen that so far."
I can see how this may appear to be the case but the reality is different. Claims of having had a vision are met with praise only by those that believe they are from God. Many people, including me, politely avoid commentating unless we have something new or helpful to say. Silence does not mean consent, acceptance or endorsement. It shows respect and allows room for resoned debate as it becomes appropriate.
We have commented many times and made our views clear over many years on this forum. Despite my sometimes robust comments to Christians over the years, I was personally invited to join the forum you have refered to by both Aguest and Tec, who also sought approval from Psacramento. They wanted an Athiest as a moderator to help insure fairness. Outlaw is also an atheist moderator. We feel no need to intrude on every thread and ridicule other people’s faith. It is after all a forum designed for Christians to discuss matters which interest them.
The following quote is a comment I made on that forum, " Some interesting posts that illustrate how faith is a part of your life. I would like to share my faith with you but it would be dishonest of me claim I have a faith. Perhaps it is more of an awareness of being part of something that cannot be explained with words. An awareness that grows stronger in silence and solitude. I can relate to James Thomas’ understanding in a direct way. The Christian viewpoint is an indirect connection to me. Of course Christians will see what I have said the other way round."
On this excellent forum there are many regular posters who avoid getting into rows over matters of belief. They enjoy the variety and good company that this forum offers. They comment and share their views but feel no need to pelt every declaration of faith with stones. Between the extremes of Atheist and ardent vision enhance Christian, are many shades of belief, as you have expressed about yourself. Like you Palmtree, I consider myself to be somewhere along the scale; simply a seeker of truth with no fixed destination in mind. We are able to accept others right to hold their beliefs without accepting the beliefs.
People with strong personalities may give the impression of dominating forum discussion because they entertain and provide something to bat against. But many of the most helpful comments are made by posters who seldom comment. A number of posters who have left expressed that they felt unwanted, overlooked and unheard. Perhaps we should encourage these timid and often overlooked posters to share more of their insights with us. Let them know that we do appreciate their thoughts, share their feelings and value them as we look for treasure hidden in the seaweed.
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soft+gentle
I guess my reply to the question posed by tec is that I'l like to be able to push the envelope without making anyone feel vulnerable. Atheism imo is still in its infancy and has its own stories, ideologies and mythologies like religions and I'd like to be able to argue against all of this whilst formulating my own ideology as I am coming to the conclusion that it is healthy to have one. So I guess what I am asking is we all (including myself) develop a little objectivity to have a rational discussion.
I have lost my passwords for shelby's site (edit: have found one of them) otherwise if I'd felt like saying something I would have said that I have mixed feelings about her vision. I understand the outrage expressed by many but on the other hand if we receive the vision from the angle of what was low being put on high - a reversal of her awful plight within Jehovahs witnesses then we can bring some fresh prespective to her experience.
edit: i hope this doesn't sound rude or condescending
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palmtree67
Well, Glad I had another peek over there this morning, and you're right - one person questioned AGuest on her vision and her prophecy.
And they were soundly thumped by her, told that they just don't want others to be happy, called a Pharisee, and warned of the consequences of going against miracles of holy spirit.
It looks like they have left now and won't be back.
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PSacramento
RE: Shelbys site.
Sometimes we see what we want to see and other times, when we don't see what we expect, we think it's not there.
Personally I disagree with Shelby on a few things, I am just not rude and condesending about it.
I tend to follow Paul's view that, regardless of HOW Christ is being talked about, He IS being talked about.
I do NOT agree that we need to use the Hebrew form Jaheshua and that the greek word Ieosus has ANYTHING to do with Zeus.
I don't always agree on how Shelby express her views BUT respect them and protect her right to express them.
Shelby NEVER asks ANYONE to believer Her or follow her, she ALWAYS tells people to follow Christ and ask HIM.
I have never seen an angel or angelic being and have never seen God or My Lord so I can't comment on how they look at all,period.
I am orthodox in my views ( gasp, I know) and while Shelby and I disgaree in regards to some orthodoxy and religion, we deal with those disagreements just fine because we BOTH serve Our Lord and Saviour and both know THAT is what matters.
People shouldn't confuse agreement with "following".
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THE GLADIATOR
Palmtrees, I hope that you were able to find something of value in my post that encourages you to feel more positive about the state of play.
The last paragraph was in line with Tec’s opening questions. It also relates to the thread on whether we need a truce and offers a practical suggestion.
Good post Psacramento. You have been an example to me over the years o f patience and tolerance, which are strengths not weaknesses.