Which is best? An EVOLVED or a CREATED human?

by Terry 42 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • Terry
    Terry

    Consider the implication of being a CREATED human as opposed to an evolved human.

    The nature a created human has is GIVEN due to intentionality. The creator wills that nature upon the creature.

    What escape from nature is there?

    To desire to be other than what you are when what you are is god-determined has enormous importance to our understanding.

    Nothing is anything without the disambiguation of a "nature".

    (Note: read the next sentence slowly and thoughtfully....)

    Otherwise everything is everything instead of something and ultimately THE thing which isn't everything else.

    Now if that sounds like gobblety-gook it's only because you didn't bother to read it carefully.

    What a human is follows the nature of what it is to be human.

    It cannot be other.

    (Oh come on!! Just stop and pay attention. Read carefully. Don't give up so fast!)

    The biblical religious story that imposes a condition of ambitious greed on humanity is a curious one, indeed.

    Man desires to be LIKE god for a reason: Knowledge. After all, the tree upon which the fruit grows is the Tree of Knowledge. Of what?

    Knowledge is not a juice or a pulp but an experienced reality.

    Virginity is not ignorance of the sex act. Virginity is ignorance of the experience of the sex act.

    Man's nature is not one of compliant ignorance. Homo sapien means something. See that "sapien"? What does it mean? It means: WISE.

    Ignorance of experience is not wise.

    A created being has no history.

    A created being has no family.

    A created being merely exists as the thing made; no better and no worse.

    But, the other alternative is the one Evolution describes as a "work in progress". Progress is always defined as survival in the face of change.

    Man must eat. Eating poison is not wise. Experiencing death is not knowledge because that knowledge cannot be useful for survival.

    Everything that the evolved man IS (the NATURE of man) is a RESULT of millions of survivals in an unbroken chain of experience.

    For lower animals the "experience" is retained as instinct.

    For homo sapien it is not. WHY?

    How useful is instinct for survival that obviously worked for ancestors passing on a gene? Success literally BREEDS success.

    What does an instinctive creature lack? The skill to see itself recursively as improvable by choice.

    Homo sapien is free of instinct and has broken free of "determined" patterns of behavior only in so far as man innovates.

    The self-awareness of man's innovation begins with the idea that he is superior on purpose.

    What has man innovated for himself? The imagination to see himself as willed into existence as a Free creature whose source is a caring God.

  • PSacramento
    PSacramento

    Why not both?

  • Terry
    Terry

    Evidence.

  • PSacramento
    PSacramento

    Evidence for macro-evolution you mean?

    :P

    Just kidding, as one that agrees with the theory of evolution and that micro-evolution ( which has been proven) can over time become macro-evolution (which has not been proven), I don't see a evidence for life "evolving" from nothing. Evolution is change over time of an EXISTING species/life form.

    It doesn't address WHERE and HOW that life form came to be.

    We have evidence that the universe had a beginning so that beginning was "created" from something or have we proven that energy can "evolve" by itself without any ouside force?

  • james_woods
    james_woods

    I just posted on the Einstein thread that this is a b4tter place to debate this issue than on it...it is about Einstein's approach to religion.

    One thing to consider about Terry's point is the notion of free will: I say evolved naturalists argue against the truest sense of free will; in the sense that all decisions are greatly influenced by evolution (instinct) and personal experience (interaction with others of the species).

    The point being this - does a bacterium have free will? Does a roundworm? A mole?

    At what point up the evolutionary scale does "free will" begin and instinctive behavior fall off?

    At what point could one say that all human instinctive behaviors have been left behind and free will has taken their place?

    As a second thought - is the imagination of a god-system truly an act of human free will, or is that itself an instinctive or learned behavior for our species?

  • PSacramento
    PSacramento
    At what point up the evolutionary scale does "free will" begin and instinctive behavior fall off?
    At what point could one say that all human instinctive behaviors have been left behind and free will has taken their place?
    As a second thought - is the imagination of a god-system truly an act of human free will, or is that itself an instinctive or learned behavior for our species?

    I think that "free will" exists at the moment of self-consiousness, when we realize that we HAVE a will.

  • Terry
    Terry

    At what point up the evolutionary scale does "free will" begin and instinctive behavior fall off?

    Self-awareness has to be the quickening.

    It objectifies what had previously been entirely subjective.

    An ape noticing its own reflection in water at first objectifies the visual as "other".

    Further scrutiny testifies that this "other" is copying....every....gesture........WTF?!!

  • james_woods
    james_woods

    Psac, Terry - surely you are not saying that self-awareness equates to free will?

  • PSacramento
    PSacramento
    Psac, Terry - surely you are not saying that self-awareness equates to free will?

    Define free will.

    If free will is the ability to choose betwee right and wrong then yes, self-awareness would have to be some type of prerequiste.

  • james_woods
    james_woods

    Well, actually (to my thinking) "free will" does not really have any connection per se to right versus wrong.

    To me, it just means that a human could theoretically make a decision that is completely free from the influence of inherited behavior or the learning experiences gained from his prior environment.

    In that sense of the term, I highly doubt that free will is really possible for a human in ANY circumstance.

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