I won't continue my devil's advocacy past this point, as I sense that I have annoyed you, sd-7, and that was not my intention; perhaps you're not a big fan of Bro. Olson. I was only attempting to have a level-headed dialectical exchange, since none of your points would be convincing to a long-time Witness, and I wanted to help.
Well, okay, maybe you did annoy me, but that's not always a bad thing, depends on the day, plus I don't seem to have thick enough skin for JWN most of the time if the spotlight's on my actual thoughts. At least I see where you're coming from a little better, though.
Actually, I was trying to correct you on the "Witness viewpoint". Witnesses often refer to the likelihood that we do benefit from individual, physical angelic protection.
A valid point there--I think the problem is that the literature sort of does the typical speaking-out-of-both-sides-of-mouth thing on this issue. Sorry I was only presenting the one side, man, my argumentation sux, badly, but I usually try actually reviewing stuff before posting it.
Nor does a decline in belief in God demonstrably lead to a more rational world.
Well, human nature is such that probably such a world isn't very likely anyway--most people are pretty content not asking the big questions. Good point, there. I did realize that my point in this regard also sucked just before I clicked Submit. So...maybe this thread is kind of a downer, at this point. I usually try not to have so many holes in the logic.
Did not God tell them that they were not to eat from the tree or they would die? What more did they need to know?
I think it was only fair that God explain that he was going to curse the ground so it wouldn't produce much and that Eve was going to have pains during childbirth. Neither of those things was mentioned during the issuing of the command. It makes it look like it was tacked on arbitrarily as a punishment. The ground didn't sin, Adam did, so why curse the ground? If this is about justice, the punishment was supposed to be death, though apparently that was just a general statement, and oh by the way, it'll be a slow and painful death and your life will suck from now on, Dad who has to feed the human race on thorns and thistles and Mom who has to push out 500 babies in incredible pain.
But of course, I wasn't trying to present this argument to a JW. I can't even honestly make a real assertion that these invisible spirits don't exist. It's an unprovable idea, as they're invisible, and there are a number of potential possibilities that may or may not include invisible spirits existing. I do see your points, though. I wouldn't dare try to argue that God or Satan doesn't exist to a JW. That'd be a fool's errand. I mean, I'm a door mat, so...being a fool would actually be a step up. So I can see why you'd take the ball and run with it on this thread. Better to be a door mat, by far. At least there's less laughter involved than in being a fool.
But thanks for putting those thoughts out there. I guess I was just thinking out loud without a fact/logic-checker in place. I'm too tired to worry about it anyway. We're all going to die regardless, so...it's sort of a silly thing to argue about, in the end. We'll get to meet all the gods and demons we want on that day. I'll have to remember to attach an invisible postcard to me so I can write you from hell one of these days.
Oh, and about the naked woman dream thing...well, maybe I exaggerated a bit. It was just some pretty standard sex with her on top, in the dream. Didn't have wings, either. It was probably just an erotic dream. Man, I miss having those. They used to happen so much more when I was younger. It truly is better not to have sex at all, because at least you won't want it nearly as much...as I do now....but this thread isn't about that, so time to shut up.
--sd-7
