I'll explain to him your advice: If you want to be happy there are things in life you will have to let go of.
No truer words ....... good advise for all ex-jws
There are really TWO Watchtower Societies
by Terry 67 Replies latest watchtower beliefs
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Terry
Terry, You have written over 14,500 posts. Possibly you have, completely, discussed this:
Is it possible to make a Group Action Lawsuit against the WTS, in reference to the "secret" part of the conversation, of what you were to tell the Judge and what you were to conveniently, (for the Watch Tower) told, to leave out?
Just Lois
No. Joining a religion is consent. Remaining in is consent. Complying with dogma is voluntary.
The elders do plenty in disfellowship cases to get on the wrong side of the law if you can get an attorney to take the case on contingency basis.
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Quendi
I have greatly appreciated everyone’s contributions to this thread, but I want to especially thank Ding for his most lucid summation. I originally studied in the old The Truth That Leads to Eternal Life book back in 1974 and was convinced I had found the true religion. The teachings of the Witnesses seemed so focused and rational to me and I also had deep respect for the people who introduced me to the religion: my aunt’s family and the man who formally studied with me after I went away to college.
I look back on those years and all that I did in the WTS vineyard and marvel now that I accepted these teachings and promoted them as enthusiastically as I did. I marvel now that I got out at all and wonder what my state would be now if I had not first looked at the Bible without WTS publications and how being disfellowshipped also rekindled dormant critical thinking abilities.
I am glad that the Internet is playing such a huge role in waking people up and helping them make good their escape. Much like the printing press made the Reformation possible, the Internet will play a critical part in bringing about the downfall of this execrable cult.
Quendi
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alecholmesthedetective
Wow, I really like this thread, thanks Terry.
I was a born in who really believed it was the truth, and I liked to read, study, and research to 'keep testing whether I was in the faith' and to 'make the truth my own'. And exactly what you described happened to me, I stood at a crossroads and could not comply anymore.
What I find very true in your post is that I have a very good friend who up to a point agrees with me a lot of things are wrong in the WT but he simply doesn't show me any concrete signs that he cares. He just goes through the motions, doesn't want to lose his friends now nor his ticket to paradise. He barely goes out in service or anything, but is semi-regular at the meetings.
He thinks I'm entitled to do what I want but not to upset the little consciences of others by speaking out against the WT, he expressed this view when I told him I was thinking of starting a blog to put my views in writing and available to anyone.
So he seems to fit your description of those who don't care.
But I'm sure there some in there who do and who need us. And that is why we do not keep silent.
That is why we do not give up on them.
Alec
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Farkel
Howdy Terry,
:I'd spoken previously of my interview with the F.B.I. and my hearing before the Draft Board. I was on the brink--as it were--of what came next.
Yep. Been there. Done that. As you well know.
:SIDEBAR: Once a month the inmates received an official visit from outside the prison by a kind of Circuit Servant. His name was Bourgeosie (Booj-swah).
Circuit Servant...Bourgeosie...hmmm. Isn't that a bit redundant? :)
Ray Franz summed up all that "no alternative military" bullshit in COC. He asked the perfectly logical question Freddie Franz had hoped no one would ever ask when he came up with his insanity on that issue: how is accepting the military's option to serve in an alternative to military service a "compromise" of "Christian Integrity(tm)" and accepting a sentence by a Federal Judge to do the same alternative to military service NOT a "compromise" of "Christian Integrity"?
If alternative military service is so bad and wrong by the almighty Watchtower God "Jehovah", then why is it NOT bad if a judge says to do it, but it IS so bad and wrong if the military says to do it? You did hard time. I did soft time because my sentence came about a year or so after yours and times had changed. Almost two dozen years later "Jehovah" changed His mind and basically, said all that shit we went through was because of WTS bullshit. To put it bluntly, "Jehovah" said his one and only true spokesmen on earth were not only bullshitters but shameless liars. But it was far more serious for you and I than just mere bullshit. In the meantime, the WTS sold books. Lots of books. By the way (you already know this) for the sake of newer readers, when I questioned my mom why I had to sacrifice two long years of my young life for Freddie's insanity on alternative military service, she said, "well, maybe Jehovah was testing you." I replied to her, "So Jehovah let a religious group 'test' me by forcing me to conform to a false belief?" Here was her answer: . Farkel -
bethelyellowdollarbag
I like the idea of their being two classes of Witnesses. Maybe that phenomenon is not limited to JW's though.
I've heard it said that there are engineers and everyone else. If a non-engineer sees something broken they accept that it is broken and if necessary replace it or find someone to fix it. An engineer wants to know why and thinks about how to fix it themselves.
There are cooks and diners. A diner tastes a new dish and says that tastes good. A cook is thinking about what spices make up that taste.
There are people who put on whatever is in their closet. Others make an effort to combine fashionable clothes.
Maybe it is simply a matter of what people care about. We all care about different things. How many times did I study the Babylon the Great Book? I had no interest in it at all. I just went through the motions.
I was born in, a pioneer a servant and a Bethelite. I never got disfellowshipped but I did get bored. I still believed that the JW's were the one true religion I just wanted to spend my time doing something interesting. I felt very guilty missing meetings at first but science interested me. The more I learned about science the more unlikely it seemed that the JW description of the world was correct.
Every JW sees things that bother them or that don't make sense. You use mental tricks to convince yourself that while that one thing doesn't make sense it is not enough to give up the whole body of "truth". Once you get to the point where you give yourself permission to consider that maybe it isn't the "truth" then a flood of these "One thing's " come crashing down and you realize that their wasn't one thing there were many things. Now with the new perspective you can't even imagine how you could have been fooled for so long.
It seems like there are many ways out:
Some of us are disillusioned by the apparent doctrinal vagrancies that seem to come and go and just don't make sense.
Some of us are disappointed that JW teachings contradict good science.
Some of us are either personally hurt or have loved ones hurt by draconian shunning practices and leave because it seems cruel.
Now that I can look back with an almost 30 year space everything makes total sense. If my starting premise was wrong everything following is likely to be wrong. If I believed that I had the one true religion and that the world as we know it will end in a few years everything I did at the time made perfect sense.
I was fooled, I no longer believe in god at all. The ransom sacrifice makes no sense to me. The whole story of the Jews taking over the Promised Land now has a sinister military smell. The concept of faith which was supposed to be a good thing now seems the ultimate stupidity.
With my new view of the world all the actions of the Society now make perfect sense. Just like all other religious people in the past and present they can and indeed should do absolutely everything in their power to protect themselves and promote their view. A religious person can logically do anything and for them it is the right thing to do.
A mother can drown her babies so the devil doesn't get them.
A military leader can exterminate women and children that have been contaminated by evil.
Lies, murder torture are all tools of those with faith.
And it all comes from one simple concept. The concept that there is an all-powerful God that knows what is best for us.
Yes it is true that some religious people have embraced tolerance but often it is in name only. The core of most current religions is the concept that I'm right you're wrong and if you don't do things my god's way something bad will happen to you.
The JW's are special only in that they are slightly more extreme than some but not as extreme as others.
So I agree with the OP that there are two categories (and more) and that the leadership does and did some really evil things. It is not only to be expected it was guaranteed to happen.
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never a jw
Moshe,
Regarding the two brains, I found your comment so true. Just yesterday I asked my brother, a JW who has been in the Org for 25 years.
Me: "Do you believe in the literal flood"
His response without even making eye contact. "I do".
My follow up question: "What about the geological, the archeological and the historical record".
His response: "It is of no interest to me". At this point he was turned away from me.
My brother does great work and can have very intelligent conversations in any other field that does not touch his religion. This experience was quite surprising for me. I thought he would be the first JW who would try to debate me. NO!. I tried at least five times before to engage my JW's relatives and even an elder. They all ran away.
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never a jw
Nickolas, Terry may have made a factual statement regarding the WT leaders. I have never been hurt by the WT since I have never been a JW, and yet I agree with Terry's description of the WT. It seems that you are inferring more than what the statement describes.
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irondork
Interesting OP.
I need to find the long version of your story. Quite impressive.
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Nickolas
Nickolas, Terry may have made a factual statement regarding the WT leaders. I have never been hurt by the WT since I have never been a JW, and yet I agree with Terry's description of the WT. It seems that you are inferring more than what the statement describes.
(Pardon me, Terry, while I answer this.) Terry's OP is interesting and insightful. I infer nothing from it beyond what he said and do not disagree with it. I am familiar with Terry's story because I have read his account of it many times in different threads he has initiated over the years, often like this one drawing new insights. As a consequence the degree to which I am emotionally moved by the background story is muted, even if the new insights are intriguing. That doesn't mean I discount his pain. It is real, and still swirling around his head after decades of estrangement from the Society that caused it. My observation is peripheral. It is that he and many others spending so much of their lives in this forum have been victimised by the Watchtower but can't bring themselves to escape its continued negative impact on their lives. They however genuinely want to help others cope with their pain. From my own experience you will be much more effective reaching out to help others heal their wounds if you have succeeded in healing your own. It is otherwise a game of Ain't It Awful, and nobody heals. (Ref. "Games People Play", Eric Berne (1964))