The official list of things for which you may be disfellowshipped

by slimboyfat 80 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  slimboyfat

  Can anyone make any sense of paragraph 7 in the "offenses requiring judicial decisions" section? Is there an actual disfellowshipping offense included there, and if so what is it?

  7. One who was raped would not be guilty of pornei'a. Discernment is needed in considering claims of rape, taking into consideration such factors as the mental disposition of the person, the circumstances that led up to the incident, and any delay in reporting. (emphasis original)

  What on earth does that mean? In what sense is this a judicial matter for the victim? Discernment is needed in determining what exactly? And what are the consequences of "mental disposition", "circumstances that led up to the incident", and "delay in reporting"?
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  slimboyfat

  Does it mean that if there is a "delay in reporting" that the woman should not be believed that she was raped and she should be disciplined for fornication?
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  notsurewheretogo

  That list is surely very incomplete? What about gambling? You can be disfellowshipped for that and I never saw it on the list...

  Gluttony, Slander etc are others...
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  Oubliette

  SBF: What on earth does that mean?

  No one knows what it means.

  The writers of this crap like to believe they're intelligent, righteous, God-fearing people. But they're not.

  What they are is: unintelligent, uneducated, self-righteous control-freaks operating under the delusion that God directs them through his "Holy Spirit."

  They are delusional.

  Stop trying to make sense of nonsense. Appreciate it for what it is: clear evidence of a manipulative, high-control cult.

  Oubliette
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  sir82

  My best guess on paragraph 7 is that are speaking of, not violent rape by a stranger, but a case where a couple is caught in the act, or one gets a case of conscience-itis and confesses to the elders.

  And then, the girl says "no, it wasn't consensual, he raped me!"

  I think it is saying that the elders would need to use discernment to determine whether the claim of rape was "real", or a lie in an effort to avoid consequences.

  That is a complete and utter guess though - who knows what they really had in mind.
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  jwfacts

  7. One who was raped would not be guilty of pornei'a . Discernment is needed in considering claims of rape, taking into consideration such factors as the mental disposition of the person, the circumstances that led up to the incident, and any delay in reporting. (emphasis original)

  Is that talking about the person raped, or the person that is accused of being a rapist?

  Either way it is terrible. Terrible to put a person who was raped through a JC to see if they are guilty of porneia or were truly raped. And terrible that if it is referring to a rapist that elders would take it upon themselves to determine that it was rape, rather than letting the authorities determine it.
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  DeWandelaar

  7. One who was raped would not be guilty of pornei'a . Discernment is needed in considering claims of rape, taking into consideration such factors as the mental disposition of the person, the circumstances that led up to the incident, and any delay in reporting. (emphasis original)

  ... the circumstances that led up to the incident ... so being in the wrong place and the wrong time might soften the verdict for a rapist and MIGHT make it pornei'a

  ... delay in reporting ... as if someone who is raped is going to report straightaway... most victims don't because of the shame...

  It is so full of bullcrap I can't hardly read it all!
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  blondie

  I have been told by elders that it is hard to prove slander, gluttony, and gambling. I know many people think overweight/obesity = gluttony but that is not necessarily true; the same is true with slander, jws are such a gossipy group, it is hard to prove evil intent rather than improper curiosity. And gambling

  Not a conscience matter; I'm sure they are careful who they tell and keep themselves in a pocket of deniability. I once observed some brothers playing penny ante poker at a jw "get-together" at someone's home. The elders we approached said they would not nitpick about a low stakes game as long as it was not advertised, as they looked at us telling us that they would deal with us if we "gossiped" about it.
  out4good3	Re: Has Gambling Become A Conscience Issue Among JWs? posted ~ a year ago (9/26/2011)
  Post 917 of 1166 Since 1/13/2002	In other words Blondie "go somewhere, sit your ass down, and keep your mouth shut.........woman. When we want your opinion on something, we'll give it to you!"
  sir82	Re: Has Gambling Become A Conscience Issue Among JWs? posted ~ a year ago (9/26/2011)
  Mongolia Post 5640 of 7629 Since 5/17/2005	There's a comment somewhere in the new elders' manual, something about how the elders shouldn't get involved in "petty" gambling between JWs so long as they aren't "promoting" it. I.e. as usual, things are quite vague and open to interpretation. This protects the Society, who can say in virtually any situation "but we never said to do that!" However, it does seem to indicate a somewhat softened stance. As you noted, in years past even betting a penny would be considered a "serious sin" worthy of a judicial committee. My best guess is that some mid- to high-level Bethelites enjoy filling in Super Bowl squares and/or NCAA basketball brackets. So long as they keep it quiet, and the stakes aren't too high, it seems they won't get tossed out of Bethel for it.

  http://www.jehovahs-witness.net/watchtower/beliefs/216295/1/Has-Gambling-Become-A-Conscience-Issue-Among-JWs
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  Terry

  It is astounding that a janitor or window washer assumes the power to judge in matters of rape or child molestation!

  When did being educated as a counselor become unnecessary? Oh--right! I forgot....never mind.
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  WTWizard

  About half of the list involves sex--regulating sex to prevent full enjoyment of it. Where is enslaving others? Where is torturing others to get them into your belief system? (Such as badgering householders to accept and continue a study.) What about hiding the truth? It is obvious that Satan is the real Savior--just read the first 3 chapters of Genesis and find out that joke-hova condones slavery. Is it that being free or wanting freedom is bad to joke-hova since that thing actually hates the human race?