You Know admits his god is weak!

by ozziepost 39 Replies latest jw friends

• 

  ozziepost

  In a strong statement of faith on another thread, our regular poster and self-appointed chief WTS apologist gave this description of the god of Jehovah's Witnesses:

  The controversy is between Jehovah and Satan.

  That will satisfy Satan's acusations that Jehovah has put a protective hedge around us

  So the god he worships is on an equal footing with a created being? How else could there be a controversy?

  Further he states that his god is concerned by the accusations of this same created being.

  Perhaps this is a teaching of the WTS but where is it in scripture?

  A reading of scripture shows that God always is in control. Pity the poor Dub who has to follow a god who was thought at one time to live in the galaxy of Pleiedes. Yep, travel far enough into space and you're sure to find heaven! That seems to be the legacy from the Joe Ratherflawed years.

  Ironically the WTS latest video which describes the history of the Witnesses in the Soviet Union (now Russia) includes a scene where the Soviets proclaim after the first space trip by Yuri Gagarin that there could be no God because Gagarin didn't find him!! Ratherflawed would have loved that.

  Pity You Know who worships what he doesn't know, a weak god.

  Cheers,
  Ozzie

  "If our hopes for peace are placed in the hands of imperfect people, they are bound to evaporate."

  
  - Ron Hutchcraft Surviving the Storms of Stress
• 

  Will Power

  "Hear the word of Jehovah, you men who are trembling at his word: "Your brothers that are hating you, that are excluding you by reason of my name, said, 'May Jehovah be glorified!' He must also appear with rejoicing on your part, and they are the ones that will be put to shame."/ You Know

  I get the feeling that YouKnow is also hoping the WT will fall and he will be vindicated! His choice of scripture here to explain how he feels about the younger so called "annointed" and or prominent ones excluding him, a long time servant, annointed, and loyal one from important duties which the bible says should be his. He is biding his time when they are the ones that will be put to shame

  Interesting.

  Also, if one believes in One, True, Almighty, All Powerful, All Knowing God, then how could this "being" be rattled by anything? Nothing occurs unless it is His will. To set this "Being" up in the middle of a "controversy" is absurd and puts this god as you say, in a less than Almighty, all powerful position. A Tribal tug of war.
• 

  roybatty

  The whole issue of “universal sovereignty” was one that I just never completely understood, even when I was giving public talks on the topic. I mean, supposedly here is Almighty God allowing Satan to kill billions of people (let alone the thousands or millions of angels he ensnared) all because He’s worried that angels will question His right to rule? Yeah, right.
  When I tell my 11 year old son and 8 year old daughter to do something, like wear their coats outside because it’s cold, it’s a given that they will question my decision. Why? Because they lack the experience that comes with age. Would I care if their friends questioned my right to tell my kids what to do? No. I believe the same comparison can be made to God and His dealings with us. The “universal sovereignty” issue has no bases in the Bible and can only be defended by misapplying the book of Job and other passages that don't even mention the phrase.
• 

  SYN

  Thanks OzziePost, you've hilighted one of the essential logical failings of virtually all Christian religions. Say stuff like this to their faces tho, and they get all upset and say that you don't have faith.

  PFFFF.

  Whatever.

  My religion is C++.

  
  I'm sure glad we don't vote anymore like we did before we got the truth. Now we get to complain about everything ALL the politicians do!
  [SYN], UADA - Unseen Apostate Directorate, Africa
• 

  MavMan

  It's not about who is more powerful. Of course that Jehovah is more powerful than Satan. The issue is about sovereignty and who has the right to rule. Satan never accused Jehovah of being weeker but questioned the right of rulership.

  You need to reread YouKnow's post and understand that this is what he is referring to.
• 

  Will Power

  The right to rule , hmmmmmm
  Do you think God is worried? or even cares about this pip squeak?

  So will Satan be suing God for sovereignty to try and get ownership? Or will there be a referendum? Is that why there are so many lawyers in Brooklyn? To make sure the "paperwork" is in order?

  Give me a break. (Hey theres a good one for Stossels 20/20)
• 

  Yadirf

  A reading of scripture shows that God always is in control.

  Well, of course God is always in control ... EXCEPT when he is allowing another person to be in control.

  1) Has God done such a thing?
  2) Will he do such a thing in the future?

  Answer to question #1:
  Of course he has. He has allowed Satan the dragon to be in control of man’s system for the duration of the times of the gentiles -- which equates with the dragon’s 7 heads, and their parallel of the wild beast’s 7 heads. (see Revelation, chapters 12 and 13) The very fact that the dragon itself has a DIADEM on each of its 7 heads determines beyond a shadow of a doubt that Satan, whom the dragon symbolizes, rules the 7 heads of the wild beast.

  Answer to question #2:
  Sure he will. Once world control is taken away from the dragon God will place it into the hands of his own Son for the duration of a thousand years. After that period Jesus will return the jurisdiction that he had been given back into his Father's hands. Then God will retain full control over his universe forever after that.

  Yadirf

  Daniel 11:35 ... a KEY prophecy that must be fulfilled before the "time of the end" gets underway.
• 

  Will Power

  Soap Opera, Chain Letters, telemarketers, used car salesmen, busy phones, long lines at the bank, yardif's fascination with fantasy worlds.

  Now fantasy I like, because I know that thats JUST WHAT IT IS.
  But they use fantastic imagery to tell a story, usually with a "moral" at the end. Hmmm, that's weird. Using imagery to tell a story, maybe I could use this idea to teach small immature ones the difference between what is good and what is unacceptable. But I will keep it rated G, wouldn't want them developing paranoia later in life.
• 

  You Know

  Let me try and set you straight, assuming that that is humanly possible.

  Jehovah's entering into a controversy with one of his formerly beloved sons, but nonetheless an inferior creature, is not an act of weakness. On the contrary, the fact that in the book of Job Jehovah initiated the conversation with Satan and invited him to say before the entire assembly of angels what was on his mind exactly, demonstrates Jehovah's complete mastery of the situation, and his absolute confidence in his own righteousness.

  That the controversy was still ongoing when Christ was on the earth is evident from the fact that Satan repeatedly tempted Christ and sought by various means to entrap him or in some way intimidate him in order to try and prove his point. Not only that, but Jesus told Peter on the night of his arrest that Satan had demanded to have the apostles to sift them as wheat. Obviously, Satan demanded that of Jehovah. That gets to the very heart of the controversy and shows why your reasoning is screwy. As indicated in the book of Job and the demand Satan made to have the apostles to shake and sift them, the issue is not merely involving Jehovah or his right to rule, but also the Devil accused all creation of being motivated by self-interest. Jehovah couldn't answer that aspect of Satan's challenge. Only God's creatures could. That's why in the case of Job Jehovah said: "Look! He is in your hands, only don't thrust out your hand against his soul." Same thing in the case of the apostles, and subsequently all Christians, that Jehovah allows Satan the opportunity to tempt and test each one, allowing each individual the opportunity to prove their loyalty to God under test. Of course, Jehovah knew from the beginning that the Devil was a liar, that some of his creatures would remain true and could never be broken no matter how much pressure the demons brought to bear upon them. But, the point is God had to step back and allow his servants to be put into situations that he personally would prefer them not to have to suffer.

  In Revelation Satan is called the "accuser of our brothers who accuses them night and day." Jehovah's counsel to his sons to oppose the Devil and humble themselves under the mighty hand of God indicates that the controversy is still ongoing up to the present moment and that Jehovah has in no way abdicated his position as God.

  As an aside, apostasy has always been the Devil's most effective tool. Throughout history Satan has had a lot of success corrupting God's organization. He caused Israel to stumble into apostasy many times, and he eventually corrupted the 1st century congregation through his antichrist human agents. So, as things wrap up it is no wonder that apostasy is once again spreading as a gangrenous cancer among Jehovah's people. Going forward it is certain to become a test of faith for all of Jehovah's Witnesses. / You Know
• 

  dungbeetle

  At least, YOUKNOW, you've done some thinking and some reasoning, and this is refelcted in a really good post.

  And you've kept your name-calling and holier-than-thou down to a minimum. For that I thank you. Some of us have been through enough crap (which yopu don't admit to, but that's YOUR loss) and don't need the patronizing and condescending attitude.

  But your reasoning, as usual, leaves out the human element that must be dealt with. Okay, try this: YOU come to me and tell me, "Here's the creator of the earth, the one who made the solar system and human beings and animals yadyayada.

  But you are telling me that this great and powerful creature, this God Jehovah, raised his two sons, Lucifer and Michael, and that these two sons don't get along, and start a big war in the heavens...and God can't handle this just in the spirit realm?

  What's their s**t got to do with US? Why drag us puny humans into it in the first place? Why allow their crap to spill over onto the planet earth? We humans can't even SEE these creatures, and we are defenselss before them. Why does this GOD have no feelings for us. Why does he not put some protection around us humans, so the war between these two angelic creatures and their supporting armies doesn't hurt us innocent people?

  You see why people become atheist? Namecalling and condecension and patronizing behavior aside, your God gave us the ability to reason and to ask these questions; we are asking these questions and we want answers. A God so powerful to make the solar system should be able to provide the answers to these questions.

  The Sovereignty issue doesn't explain things enough for me. How many people have already died faithful for Jehovah over the years? A hundred? A thousand? When is enough enough? If 100 million people suffer terrible deaths so that a few thousand can die loyal, why is that not enough? When will this God be SATISFIED? For every one person that DIES FAITHFULLY, millions have suffered horribly....
  WHY? What is the point in any more deaths?

  I have a theory as to the reason for all this time, but I'd like to hear yours first, You KNOW. I really would.

  waiting breatlessly class....