Does being a "born in" blur parental vs JW issues?

by obfuscatetheobvious 35 Replies latest jw experiences

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  obfuscatetheobvious

  Problem, Gio, trujw - thanks for your comments, I was composing my post and didn't see your replies. You all raise good points that I would like to address at my next opportunity - which probably won't be for a few hours or so.

  Also thank you for the welcomes! I have found help from the most unlikely people, people that I have looked down on in the past. For me being "free" doesn't mean not going to meeting/fs/personal study anymore. It's trying to break down the arrogance that I see within me.

  Be back soon.

  Cheers,

  Ob
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  LisaRose

  Having been a JW parent, I have to say yes. being a parent is hard, being a dub parent, even harder. The organization has very specific expectations of it's members, it can be a lot of pressure to raise your kids a certain way. Of course, in hindsight I wish I hadn't even bothered raising my children in the religion, but I thought I was doing the best thing at the time. I have apologized to my children for bringing them up in a cult. Fortunately, I was not an uber dub, and I diverged from the dub way as my kids got older. It wasn't in me to shove a religion down their throat, and fortunately, neither took to it, we are all out now. Of course I will never get those years back, so I regret that. I was going through my son's Facebook posts, and he made a comment that hurt. He said I wonder what it would be like to grow up with parents that had their act together. That hurts, because I thought I did my best, but obviously not.
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  obfuscatetheobvious

  LisaRose - I appreciate your honesty. It must have been hard to hear that from your son and therefore hard to share. I can't look at my dad and think that he meant anything other than the best for me and my brothers. He and my youngest brother have had issues of their own in the past and I know that dad has indicated his regret for the part he played in my brothers angst. So I'm sure he has regrets as a father. I look at him as a father and feel empathy. I look at him as a JW elder and feel intense anger. That is the blur for me - where does one stop and the other start?

  Pickler - thanks for the follow up. Your last sentence is on a topic that is sort of tied up in this for me. Yes, the org should back off. But if my parents - primarily my dad - had given me the tools, then no organization - not any - could back me into a corner. It wasn't until I started waking up that I learnt about philosophy, sophistry, fallacies, word play and particularly how these things are used in subtle combinations to persuade and convince. Why didn't he know that? Hadn't he been tricked before? Why didn't he investigate and swear that no one was going to get him again and especially his kids?!! That basic mindset of protecting your children is what drives me to investigate, understand and then teach! Your point about education is well made and I acknowledge that it has played a part in my dads parenting.

  Problem - I have no doubt that my dads upbringing influenced the way he parented us. He had 3 kids under 1 when he was 23, the 2 youngest (twins) were 2.5 months premature and one was later diagnosed with cerebral palsy. Tough start to parenting.

  Giordano - I learnt pretty early that not doing as my dad wanted meant getting the belt. How can a child, that has had "obedience" literally belted into him have any "free" choice?

  trujw - I share your jealousy. My MIL family are not witnesses (yep, I didn't want to associate with them). They are the people I most enjoy being around now - we argue, debate, share ideas (none are taboo), get angry, say sorry and get on with it!

  mrsjones - good and bad parents are in every walk of life and every section of society. I'm sorry your husband got such a raw deal. Gives my problems some perspective.

  Another thread I was reading mentioned sending a Mothers Day card. I wish I had read that prior to Sunday! As it is, it's a great idea that will help me to make contact with my mum, so flowers and a card it is!

  I really appreciate the imput and the opportunity to express myself. As I look over what I have written, some things are beginning to dawn on me and as they say, it takes two to tango.

  Cheers!

  Ob
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  Mum

  Many parents only "teach" (and I use that term loosely) their children to obey. The kids do not learn right from wrong, or anything about building character or ethical living. I was a JW parent, which I now regret. However, my daughter associated the Kingdom Hall with being imprisoned, so she never wanted to go, and would feign illness to get out of it.

  My own parents were not JW's, but my dad was narcissistic, and my mom was histrionic. We were "taught" to obey and not to do anything irritating or annoying to Mom and Dad. I think I was in my 40's before I understood that I needed to know right from wrong, not just obey those with authority over me.
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  amos77

  Growing up in the JWs and now nearly 65 and looking back, I do feel that there is huge pressure on parents, to be seen to be a "good family" despite the pressures, but particularly the husband to "manage" his family properly or theocratically, whatever that is. Ie that is used as to whether he is fit to be a servant, elder. . hence my father who abused us children with beatings, kickings, punching, for "discipline" etc. always warned us "never to talk out of the house" or he would smash us. He had to keep face at all times. Of course there will always be mother/daughter, son/father, and sibling issues that need resolving as part of growing up and as the frontal lobe develops, but being a JW exacerbates these and complicates the dynamics because you have (1) underlying value system and (2) an outward control system. When I had my last beating from my father for being rude to my other at nearly 18, he was kicking me under the bed, and I though I was going to die, so I climbed out ,stood in his face and said if he touched me again I would go to the Elders and take him to Court. He never touched me again. With the passing of time, I actually felt sorry for my parents in their chains having to keep up apperances.
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  LongHairGal

  OBFUSCATE:

  From the many stories I have read, plus what I heard personally I would have to say YES.

  Unfortunately, the JW religion turns too many parents into robots who will figuratively throw their children under the bus if they "disobey" any of the religion's teachings. They call it "tough love" and think they are doing their child a favor when they tell them they can't live there anymore and have to move out.

  I have heard of more than one story where a teenager moved out and became legally emancipated. In the long-run it appeared to have worked out but initially it was traumatic and the kids involved had a good head on their shoulders and MADE it work out.

  Even my own "dysfunctional" family was more loving than JWs.
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  flipper

  OBFUSCATE- Very great opening thread by you ! Welcome to the board ! Very interesting subject.

  I for one ( like others here I'm sure ) was raised by a very strict JW elder dad. If anything being raised by a " high profile " JW elder dad actually CLARIFIES what a normal dad in human society is as opposed to being raised by a dad who is fully devoted to the WT Society. It's like day and night and NO I don't think it " Blurs " anything about parenting - I believe it made crystal clear to me the type of father that I wanted to be to my children as opposed to the type of JW father I had.

  I exited the JW cult over 9 years ago at age 44 and yes, I raised my kids up in the JW cult. My 28 year old son is out and I'm close to him, but my 26 and 24 year old JW daughters shun me completely . In the real world ( non-JW world ) dad's support the advancement of their sons and daughters in getting an education. They compliment them on their acheivments and are there to support them when they fall. JW dad's ( especially long time elders ) are not like that. It's " organization first "- then family on the backburner or a distant 10th or more.

  As a young man being raised a Witness I was told by my JW father that we shouldn't feel proud after going out in service, he said " we were good for nothing slaves that we had done was what we OUGHT to have done. " Quoting Jesus words. So- No compliments, no nothing. We were WT slaves - that was our legacy, our expected destiny. Absolutely disgusting. Also - My dad enjoyed the elite elder spotlight being a City Overseer 40 plus years and receiving much authority over other people and enjoying his accolades . My older brother is the same as an Ex-Bethelite.

  So I was taught that it was position, power, your accomplishments, i.e. ( being an elder, Ministerial servant, or pioneer ) that was important- not how nice a person or how empathetic a person you were that counted in JW land. And it was how others in the organization looked at you on the outside as an advancing " brother " in position that counted. My dad even asked me one time " son, how are you advancing in the truth ? " I wasn't asked how my relationship with Jehovah was it was " how are you advancing ? Are you REACHING OUT for position ? " THOSE were the important things to my dad.

  Do I have daddy issues ? Yeah, you bet. But it has helped me to see the kind of dad I DID NOT want to be to my kids and thankfully I didn't give a rats a$$ about becoming an elder due to the politics involved asI wanted to be a better father to mY son. And he and I are best of friends ! So I feel being raised as a JW from a JW father enabled me to see the difference between TRUE fatherhood and real, humane fatherhood that's out in the real world. Just my 2 cents
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  Band on the Run

  I was so excited the first time I studied the NT in college. The WTBTS lies. No doubt about it. My senior aunt was a devout Witness until her death. Her life was so restricted b/c of the Witness uprbringing. She could not handle simple business transactions of everyday life. Altho she was bright as anything, she believed she was stupid. She was fortunate to marry a decent, loving Bethelite. He played such a valuable role in my life.

  So I call home from the school library every half hour with a news flash about fundamental mistakes the Witnessses made. It wasn't that I was learning scholarship as much as reading the text without WT lit. When I went to visit her, I thought I would find a very tactful, gentle way of informng her. As I broached the subject so delicately, I saw her face. She was absolutely stricken. I was not being condemned fopr being an apostate or talking in her home. She had no life outside the Witnesses. If she were in her twenties, I would have continued. I am not exagerrating that I believed she would have a nervous breakdown if I continued. So I dropped the subject.

  The look on her face said much about the Witnesses. She never believed she would make Armageddon b/c she was never good enough. Well, she if could not make it, no one can.

  On the other hand, I would sometimes bring local friends to her home en route to a film or shopping. My friends were so impressed with her character.
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  EmptyInside

  I think being raised by Witness parents,just give children and parents more things to fight over. But,as someone else pointed out,it just adds to the problems of growing up and becoming an independent adult.

  Plus,there is an issue when one is disfellowshipped. And the Witness family members feel obliged,in most cases,to shun the one disfellowshipped. It's really sad.

  The religion certainly effects family dynamics. And creates more issues where there normally would be none.

  I feel most sorry for those whose parents suffered with mental health issues. It seems it makes them more fanatical about the religion,which is, extra difficult for the children.
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  LoisLane looking for Superman

  Hello and Welcome Obfuscate The Obvious!

  Great name.

  My parents were abusive. I hadn't thought about it until reading your thread, but I think the abuse would have been the same, whichever religion they chose.

  Just Lois