For Those who believe the Bible is truly the word of God (page 2)

paul from cleveland

Who decided which books would be included in the bible? Wasn't it the pagan Roman emperor Constantine in the fourth century that got the church leaders together to vote on which books should be included? The fact that a pagan Roman emperor is responsible for the collection of books we consider "the bible" today would be one vote against it being the word of God.

Ding

The Bible is not just one book.

It is a collection of many books.

This means there are several eyewitness accounts in the NT as to what Jesus said and did.

We accept many things about history as fact with far less attestation.

How many eyewitness accounts (or even purported eyewitness accounts) do we have of Caesar's assassination, for example?

Or Lincoln's, for that matter?

mP

@soso

People who believe in the bible are often the most dishonest people. When you challenge them with a real problem like slavery or the racism in the OT, where peoples are condemned to genocide and other evils simply because of their ancestry suddenly they are filled with excuses. They simply ignore you or walk away, all the while insisting the bible is perfect when the truth is its plain to see the motivation behind such mesages in the bible is simply human greed.

The bible was written by rich and educate people to enslave and further their selfish motivations. As always follow the money. The issue of slavery and mistreatment of women for example is best addressed as the obvious motivation by backward men with twisted and evil motivations. No God who loves everyone would make up such messages.

cofty

Vanderhoven - using the bible to confirm the bible dosn't work. Its like using Harry Potter and the Order of the Phoenix to confirm that predictions made in Harry Potter and the Chamber of Secrets came true.

I have read Keller's book a long time ago. Just because Baker Street actually exists doesn't prove Sherlock Holmes was a real detective.

Phizzy

The clue to the problem is in the thread title, those who "believe".

Belief in this sense is trusting that a certain premise is true, without satisfactory proof.

Bible "believers" cannot offer evidence as to its divine inspiration that stands any kind of scrutiny, hence they simply have to believe.

mP

@COFTY

Harry Potter is a re-write of Jesus life in a different setting. jkRowling has basically admitted this.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Religious_debates_over_the_Harry_Potter_series

A number of commentators have drawn attention to the Biblical themes and references in her final Harry Potter novel, Harry Potter and the Deathly Hallows . In an August 2007 issue of Newsweek , Lisa Miller commented that Harry dies and then comes back to life to save mankind, like Christ. She points out the title of the chapter in which this occurs—"King's Cross"—a possible allusion to Christ's cross. Also, she outlines the scene in which Harry is temporarily dead, pointing out that it places Harry in a very heaven-like setting where he talks to a father figure "whose supernatural powers are accompanied by a profound message of love". Miller argues that these parallels make it difficult to believe that the basis of the stories is Satanic. [131] There is also speculation from The Leaky Cauldron's podcast , PotterCast , episode 115 entitled "Those Deathly Hallows," in the Canon Conclusion segment with Steve Vander Ark , that the Hallows act as a parallel to the Holy Trinity; Harry accepts death as did Jesus, they both come back from death, and defeat the Devil/Voldemort. [132] Jeffrey Weiss adds, in The Dallas Morning News , that the biblical quotation "And the last enemy that shall be defeated is death," [133] featured on the tombstones of Harry's parents, refers to Christ's victory over death at the end of the world. [134] The quotation on Dumbledore's family tomb, "Where your treasure is, there your heart will be also", is from Matthew 6:21, and refers to knowing which things in life are of true value. [135] "They're very British books," Rowling revealed to an Open Book conference in October 2007, "So on a very practical note Harry was going to find biblical quotations on tombstones, [but] I think those two particular quotations he finds on the tombstones at Godric's Hollow, … almost epitomise the whole series." [117]

lost

I came an interesting article the other day.

The Bible - IS NOT INSPIRED. Nope.

The Scripture's - ARE INSPIRED.

there is a difference between the two.

I do struggle with 'belief' due to the history of man and the condition of the world and mankind.

I do argue with myself about it.

I do question it.

Then I always end up coming back to the same 'place'. Jesus.

Then I'm stumped.

mP

@lost

Is this the same Jesus, that never condemned slavery, and told poor people to pay taxes, but never gets round to condemning slavery ? Why is he so concerned with keeping the status quo for the benefit of the rich and forgets and condemns the poor to misery ? If he cant make a simple statement against this in this life forget the next.

lost

Was it not the 'rich' that tortured and killed him.

Why ?

mP

@lost

i didnt ask you who killed him. We cant judge his message because of his unfortunate end. People who are victims of injustice should not be judged because of their bad luck

We can however judge him on the message he taught. Why was he so concerned with the welfare of the rich ?

For Those who believe the Bible is truly the word of God

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