taboo

by teejay 23 Replies latest social relationships

  • Carmel
    Carmel

    I can't imagine what life would be like if I acted on every one of my animal instincts each time they popped up. I'm quite sure I would be dead from one or more of many potential killers from STDs to booze or drugs. I understand the claim that those who think they can function in an "open marriage", however, I know of none that have endured mostly for the anxiety and stress it introduces. Having been married to the same person for 39 years and not at all bored in bed, I wonder how much effort those who focus on the variety issue put into making the commitment succeed.

    On the other hand, I encourage those who think it is what they want, to go for it and find out. Just keep us posted like Butlbee and do be graphic. We have some ex-elders here that need to recharge their lives with a little voyerism.

    carmel

  • COMF
    COMF

    Just keep us posted like Butlbee and do be graphic.

    What... my "favorite foot" thread wasn't graphic enough for ya?

    Whether at Nishapur or Babylon,
    Whether the cup with sweet or bitter rum,
    The Wine of Life keeps oozing drop by drop,
    The Leaves of Life keep falling one by one.

  • bitter mango
    bitter mango

    good thread teej.. too much to say.. so i just wont .. right now anyways

    tracy, you and doug have a good relaionship.. not too often i see couples not being jelous and insecure of their partners having active pals of the opposite sex. cool

    harm, you rock exactly how you are! i'd never try to change ya hehe

    41 + 66.6 = our loss
    we're breathing only to fade away
    we're running just to get caught

  • KissAFish
    KissAFish

    teejay,
    I'll have to agree with some of your points, Marriage can be a restrainer...( real word..???)..But as a woman..a married woman, I can honestly say..I dont have a problem with opposite sex relationships..it is healthy..totally.. you do need a variety in life.different people to bring out different things about you...Also, to be honest as well, the first thing with my Husband and I was physical.. for both of us.. that is nature..pure nature.. the reproduction of the species is paramount.. None of this fluffy feelings stuff in science..( my field)...Society puts these constraints on us all ...do you stay defacto..? just casual..? marry..? gay...? anyhow... you are "made" to form a "couple" as such..and for me it was a choice..though I am not typically " exclusive" and that is a mutual decision and socially this is frowned upon...as it can go against "nature"..ooh going off the deep end..but just trying to say.. you can be married, defacto,gay,single whatever...even serve your purpose on this earth... to reproduce and still enjoy life ..it is all about choice and free will... :) and hopefully you can find somone of like mind..( dont ever try to change someone.. never happens right .... should never happen...) because that makes life wonderful, I am not directing this at ANYONE.. just a general view..

  • Abaddon
    Abaddon

    I don't think breakfast or cinema visits with members of the opposite sex are something one can reasonably object to (or would even want to object to) provided it's not happening all the time. I trust my partner, and would not restrict her freedom in such a childish way or allow mine to be similarly restricted.

    I wouldn't be with someone who disagreed with that opinion.

    I also wouldn't be with someone (in a proper relationship) who wasn't capable of not only holding up their end of a conversation, but at times of beating me over the head with it. If you need friends for conversation, you're with the wrong partner, IMHO. Maybe I'm lucky.

    So I disagree - I think some of the constraints you mention are not caused by relationships per se, but by the people in the relationships being insecure or poorly matched.

    Personally, I can have sex just as a recreational act, so an Open Relationship wouldn't be a problem if conducted sensitively.

    However I'm in a relationship with a person who would be effected (something that would mean nothing emotionally to me other than friendly affection would cause emotional turmoil in her) if I insisted on my freedom in this way, and her feelings are more important than occasional sexual gratification.

    I was in a polyamourous 'V' for a while, and it's a strain on all involved, although 'triangles', where two of the triad are bisexual and are involved with each other as well as with the third member, might be easier... or not.

    As regards women being naturally monogamous to restrict the number of children, well, I think that's a non sequiter joel.

    Regularity of intercourse is what chiefly influences the number of children a woman has.

    Studies have shown that women are more likely to orgasm with a lover thean a partner, and it's fairly well established that the female orgasm helps get sperm into the womb. Women have also been observed in studies to advertise their sexual availability more if near ovulation and away from their partner. They also have 'hidden' oestrus, meaning they don't start meiowing frantically and trying to get out when they are on heat, or don't develop massive red buttocks.

    This means that women 'created' relationships... by their fertility being hidden, a male has to hang around to make sure he fires his cannons when there are boats to shoot at. At the same time it seems women's reproductive systems, whilst set up to get a partner/co-child raiser, are also set up to increase the chances of conception if any playing is done 'away'.

    Obviously, we are socialised, but we are still monkeys.

  • Sirona
    Sirona

    Abaddon,

    You always come up with fantastic points. I really do enjoy your posts.

    If you need friends for conversation, you're with the wrong partner, IMHO. Maybe I'm lucky.
    That made me feel uncomfortable. My b/f and I can talk and chat, but for really in depth discussions there are other people I would turn to. Is that wrong? Its still something I'm thinking about as far as this relationship.

    Similarly, I don't want him having close friendships with women. This is a deficiency within myself, since my fear of being hurt is so strong. To be honest, if I wanted to spend time with another man more than I wanted to spend time with my b/f then I would seriously consider ending the relationship.

    Sirona

    ** http://www.religioustolerance.org **

  • teejay
    teejay

    Sirona,

    Abaddon said: If you need friends for conversation, you're with the wrong partner, IMHO.

    You said: That made me feel uncomfortable. My b/f and I can talk and chat, but for really in depth discussions there are other people I would turn to. Is that wrong? Its still something I'm thinking about as far as this relationship.

    Imo, you are right to give this serious thought.

    On the other hand, maybe you're worried about something you needn't be worried about. People are different and have different interests. Your boyfriend is your boyfriend because of many reasons, I suspect. When it comes to conversation, when it turns to a topic of *his* interest (different from yours?), he’s probably more than able to hold his own. Other than that, few people are the perfect match and compromises have to be made throughout the relationship, if it continues.

    I don't want him having close friendships with women. To be honest, if I wanted to spend time with another man more than I wanted to spend time with my b/f then I would seriously consider ending the relationship.

    THIS – what you’ve said here – is what this whole thread is about.

  • peaceloveharmony
    peaceloveharmony

    teejay :)

    I could prove to be very wrong about this, but I think your chances aren’t very good (probably less than 5%) of finding an eventual husband who wouldn’t have a very serious problem with you getting up on a Saturday morning and telling him that, “hey, I’m going for breakfast with my male friend Billy Bob.” And again, I could be wrong, but I think YOU’D have a problem if your husband did the same, leaving you at home in a cold bed all by yourself. Slap me if I'm wrong about that.
    *slap slap* okay you are right, if my future mate was always going out to breakfast and leaving me all alone in bed, i'd be a bit miffed, but i still contend that once in awhile would not bother me at all.

    After thinking about it for years, I think two things seem to be at work here. For one, most people have insecurities and look for “happiness” not from within but from without – from others – particularly from their significant other (boy-/ girlfriend or mate).

    Stemming from that is a related component – that virtually every person I’ve ever known really doesn’t enjoy his or her own company. They may tolerate it at times, but actually ENJOY being alone? Not a common human trait. People tend to find (or WANT to find) enjoyment only in the company of others.

    well, one reason i left my last b/f of five years was because i didn't know who i was anymore. i needed (need) to find myself. i stayed in a not so great relationship because i feared being alone. you are so right about people looking for happiness from without but i tried that for 5 years, doesn't work! so now i'm living alone, learning to be content with being alone. not sure i'll ever be happy alone but content will be good enough i think.

    So, when “marriage” (read: “exclusive, committed relationship”) enters the already unstable mix, seeing someone’s significant other having fun with someone they might just end up with is a bit disconcerting for most people. “what if they like the other person better and leaves me?” “what am I going to do all alone?” “I don’t want to be alone.” “I can’t make it by myself.”
    this was so me when i was with my guy! i was a jealous freak and so afraid of losing him. i finally started to realize about 3 yrs into the relationship that i had a problem. my feelings of jealousy were my problem. now granted this relationship was far from perfect but he did not run around on me. so i learned to acknowledge my emotion and then think about WHY i reacted the way i did. it works in other parts of life too! ah, i'm babbling, i hope this makes sense. and thanks for your well wishes on finding a secure man. i'm not really lookin' for a man right now, i'm doing okay all on my own

    okay and now to get back to the topic here....

    I]I don't want him having close friendships with women. To be honest, if I wanted to spend time with another man more than I wanted to spend time with my b/f then I would seriously consider ending the relationship.
    the close relationship part does not or would not bother me but spending a ton MORE time with someone than your significant other that easily could be a sign there might be a problem. i think it all comes down to what each person in the relationship expects or wants from said relationship. communication is key and IMO probably the hardest thing to achieve or continue in a long term committed relationship.

    okay enough babbling from me

    again great thread!

    love
    harmony

    ps. bea baby, i think you are "the one"

    A good friend is someone who will come and bail you out of jail, but a true friend will be sitting next to you saying "That was f**king awesome."[/i]

  • Sirona
    Sirona

    Teejay,

    I think the jealousy thing with me is our biggest problem. Recently, I've been much better...I don't mention it and I have sort of resigned myself to the fact that if he does run around, I can deal with it. Its about confidence. Unfortunately, I keep having dreams that he cheats and I wake up in tears.

    Sirona

    ** http://www.religioustolerance.org **

  • Abaddon
    Abaddon

    Hi Sirona (is that your real name or a handle, I can't remember, but 'Hi Sirona' looks like the title of a '50's rock'n'roll song to me... sorry, babbling) you said;

    That made me feel uncomfortable. My b/f and I can talk and chat, but for really in depth discussions there are other people I would turn to. Is that wrong? Its still something I'm thinking about as far as this relationship.
    Obviously different people want different things. I can talk all the legs off large quatrapeds, let alone the hind legs off a donkey... Delilah (screenname) my gf is, if anything, worse.

    Obviously there is a fortunate confluence there, and is a part of why we are together... we are intellectually stimulated by each other.

    Now, some people might not need that, which is fine.

    But if you feel you are missing something by not having that in a partner, then it can be a problem.

    Yes, you can have friends who fufill that need, and there are friends of mine I talk about shit I don't talk to Delilah about, but that's 'cause just as I have about a 30 minute tolerance to cookery programs and conversations, she about the same tolerance to some topics I find interesting.

    So, if it's a major thing, then it's a major thing. If it would be nice, but you're happy with all the other good things in your relationship, then it's not a biggie.

    Also, no one is static. Me and Delilah have to work on communication sometimes, despite the fact we are garralous chatterboxes, despite the fact we really, I mean really, know how to talk to each other, having been in a 'phone based LDR for four years, where bar a couple of visits a year, our only contact was the 'phone, an hour or so every night. If you find you can't fufill the need you have, then see if you can develop your boyfriend's ability to fulfill that need.

    Hell, if he needed to cross his eyes to reduce you to sobbing exstasy in bed, you'd make sure he learned that. Maybe he's never been a great talker.

    I find see, that most people can talk about difficult or deep topics. Some just need to know they can. When they realise that by talking about things in their head they can make another person happy and fufilled, and actually feel better about stuff as well, and get to ask questions back, then there can be no stopping them. Maybe he's never had a female friend he's ever had real conversations - does he seek out other people to talk about deep stuff, or does he just not talk about deep stuff? Conversation is a talent, yeah, but it can be developed.

    In most people...

    Remember, you don't have to be like other couples to make it work, and me and Delilah are not a good example, as on a good day we get looks off people in the supermarket just 'cause of the way we lean into each other's bodies in the queue for the the check-out. Not everyone is a garralous physical little animal.

    Similarly, I don't want him having close friendships with women. This is a deficiency within myself, since my fear of being hurt is so strong. To be honest, if I wanted to spend time with another man more than I wanted to spend time with my b/f then I would seriously consider ending the relationship.
    You have fear of abandonment, which is very common and understandable. I think you're right to say if there was a guy you'd rather spend time with than with your bf, then, well, it's not a good sign, and that is what I think you fear... him having a female friend he ends up wanting to spend more time with than you. And that's a reasonable feeling.

    But him having close female friends he meets up with once in a while, has a brilliant time with, is overjoyed to see, but who don't continuously impinge on your relationship is a different thing. If you trust his sexual fidelity and the female friends, that is.

    Maybe if you were able to communicate better, you'd find this fear would receed. The more you know someone, the more you can trust them (or, to be more accurate, the more you know what yo can trust them over.

    All the best

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