Does The Governing Body Believe Their Own Lies? Are They Deliberate Liars? Are They Using the Common Human Trait Of Self-Deception

by frankiespeakin 39 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • frankiespeakin
    frankiespeakin

    The Governing Body being in this, for lack of a better term state of 'narcissistic denial', they are prone towards anger at anyone that threatens the delusional bubble they live inside*.

    *http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Narcissistic_rage_and_narcissistic_injury

    Narcissistic rage is a reaction to narcissistic injury, which is a perceived threat to a narcissist's self-esteem or self-worth. Narcissistic injury (or narcissistic scar) is a phrase used by Sigmund Freud in the 1920s; narcissistic wound and narcissistic blow are further, almost interchangeable terms. [1] The term narcissistic rage was coined by Heinz Kohutin 1972.

    Narcissistic rage occurs on a continuum from instances of aloofness, and expression of mild irritation or annoyance, to serious outbursts, including violent attacks. [2] Narcissistic rage reactions are not limited to personality disorders and may be also seen in catatonic, paranoid delusion and depressive episodes. [2] It has also been suggested that narcissists have two layers of rage. The first layer of rage can be thought of as a constant anger (towards someone else), with the second layer being a self-aimed wrath........

    Kohut and self psychology [ edit source | edit beta ]

    Kohut explored a wide range of rage experiences in his seminal article 'Thoughts on Narcissism and Narcissistic Rage' (1972). [15] He considered narcissistic rage as one major form among many, contrasting it especially with mature aggression. [16] Because the very structure of the self itself is enfeebled in the narcissist, their rage cannot flower into realassertiveness; [17] and they are left instead prone to oversensitivity to perceived or imagined narcissistic injuries resulting in narcissistic rage. [18]

    For Kohut, narcissistic rage is related to narcissists' need for total control of their environment, including "the need for revenge, for righting a wrong, for undoing a hurt by whatever means". [19] It is an attempt by the narcissist to turn from a passive sense of victimization to an active role in giving pain to others, while at the same time attempting to rebuild their own (actually false) sense of self-worth. It may also involve self-protection and preservation, with rage serving to restore a sense of safety and power by destroying that which had threatened the narcissist. [19]

    Alternatively, according to Kohut, rages can be seen as a result of the shame at being faced with failure. [20] Narcissistic rage is the uncontrollable and unexpected anger that results from a narcissistic injury - a threat to a narcissist's self-esteem or worth. Rage comes in many forms, but all pertain to the same important thing, revenge. Narcissistic rages are based on fear and will endure even after the threat is gone. [21]

    To the narcissist, the rage is directed towards the person that they feel has slighted them; to other people, the rage is incoherent and unjust. This rage impairs their cognition, therefore impairing their judgment. During the rage they are prone to shouting, fact distortion and making groundless accusations. [22] In his book The Analysis of the Self, Kohut explains that expressions caused by a sense of things not going the expected way blossom into rages, and narcissists may even search for conflict to find a way to alleviate pain or suffering. [23]

  • Phizzy
    Phizzy

    Their mental condition is Cognitive Dissonance in the extreme.

    They believe the are in some way "God's Channel", but on a daily basis, and especailly when they meet on a Wednesday, they see the opposite in action. They have to try to reconcile the two "realities" in their head.

    The guys who really know it is ALL bulls*** are the writing boys, they would not use lies, half-truths, mis-quotes, loaded language and mind control techniques if they even believed they had some of the truth.

    If they believed that Jehovah, who hates a lie, was anything to do with the WT, they would be too afraid to do what they do, in every issue of the WT.

    The vast majority in the Writing department, and especially the Editorial staff must be Atheists, but Atheists living a cosseted lifestyle they wish to preserve.

    If the GB really do read and approve what is written, they certainly do not check any of the facts etc and must be aware of the mind control going on.

    With Cognitive Dissonance of that level, the GB wll make themselves very ill.

  • SAHS
    SAHS

    “Laika”: “I agree with bluesbrother, you can believe something is true and still lie in support of your belief.”

    Depends in what context a person can “lie” – relative to themselves or to others.

    If (theoretically, of course) I honestly and completely believe that I am from the planet “Poopiepants,” and I tell you that I am from the planet Poopiepants, then technically I’m not really “lying” in the classic sense of lying. Even though it’s not actually and literally true that I’m from the planet Poopiepants, if I consciously believe that I am, then I’m not “lying” to you as far as myself is concerned, because I’m not consciously lying to myself. (Don’t bother looking for “Poopiepants” on Wikipedia – I made it up.) If I actually believe that I’m from the planet Poopiepants, due to some enigmatic pathological condition, then theoretically I could successfully pass a lie detector test. (Or at least the classical type of lie detector test. I’m not so sure about the electronic real-time observational techniques used directly on the brain, such as the magnetic resonance imaging type – or is it the single photon emission tomography thing. Something like that. I’m not sure.)

    There’s the example of the alcoholic who, during his lucid, rational phase, says that he has firmly decided, just on his own willpower, to never drink again. Apparently such a person could at that moment actually pass a classic lie detector test, because he literally and absolutely believes his own convictions. But by his eventual and predictable relapse, he will end up betraying his own tangible and literal perception of reality as to the development of his future course of action which he was so absolutely sure of at the present moment. Thus, such an alcoholic keeps literally and honestly betraying himself.

    “frankiespeakin”:

    “These guys on the Governing Body . . . because they have to activate the mental defence mechanism of deception they force themselves to believe their bullshit because if they don't they know they will get found out by the other guys on the GB, so they all put on a show for each other in proving their loyalty to the cause . . .”

    Good observation. This really reminds me of those border guards along North Korea’s demilitarized zone. They are arranged in pairs who must stand facing each other. The reason for this is that if one of those guards starts to have any ideas about defecting and making a run for it, his partner facing him will quickly be able to detect it and easily be able to shoot him before he barely has a chance to turn and run at all.

    It’s as though the members of the Governing Body are all in a state of checkmate with each other, and they must remain in-placing towing their party line, otherwise, if they dare to move out of line, they will be spiritually and socially “shot to death.”

    Psychology certainly is a fascinating thing – just what really does make people “tick.”

  • Farkel
    Farkel

    Some people on this thread and over-analyzing this topic:

    : Does The Governing Body Believe Their Own Lies?

    Of course they don't.

    :Are They Deliberate Liars?

    Of course they are. Their mantra is survival of the Organization at any cost. They've lost touch with any original goals.

    :Are They Using the Common Human Trait Of Self-Deception

    See the answer to your first question.

    They are shameless liars and they know it. Survival is their main focus. Seeking genuine truth long ago went by the wayside. When one GB member shamelessly said about changing doctrine and Fred Franz that he would merely take one doctrine and move/change it by taking it from his left shoulder and putting on his right shoulder, it should be evidence enough that truth wasn't in their wheelhouse. Expediency was, though.

    They almost care less about truth than I care about their lies about truth.

    Farkel

  • zound
    zound

    When one GB member shamelessly said about changing doctrine and Fred Franz that he would merely take one doctrine and move/change it by taking it from his left shoulder and putting on his right shoulder

    Is this some quote or something? It sounds familiar but I can't remember it.

  • Vidiot
    Vidiot
    Laika - "...you can believe something is true and still lie in support of your belief."

    I fgured out a long time ago that once you resort to dishonesty to reinforce your ideology, you've pretty much invalidated your ideology.

  • Narcissistic Supply
    Narcissistic Supply

    The Watchtower and the JW’s are just a petri dish (a cultural medium) that allows the Narcissist to fully devour and prey on their victims?

    That’s all it is. It’s not really watchtower driven. It’s not really jeho witness driven. It’s driven by the hand to mouth narcissist. It’s a grass roots narcissistic movement. And i mean that literally.

    The jeho witnesses and the watchtower insulate the narcissist and allows them to prey on their victims and entrap the spirit of the individual. Really mind boggling black magic sort of stuff.

  • DesirousOfChange
    DesirousOfChange

    Less is more:

    Yes. Remember LARS? Did anyone really ever bother to read the "reams" of crap he posted here?

    Frankie, take note. While I loved the topic, I for one passed completely passed over your endless cut-n-paste of a post, but I was curious to see what others had said on the subject.

    Sorry if I have a short attention span. Part of it has to do with the fact that being a JW for so many years made it necessary for me to catch up on my retirement fund and I have to work on Saturdays to do that.

    Doc

  • frankiespeakin
  • OnTheWayOut
    OnTheWayOut

    I think the Governing Body of the Freddy and Ray Franz days was still kind of inexperienced at being in charge of Watchtower. I think they were still each individually assuming that the "other" members really did feel a touch of Holy Spirit guiding their decisions. I think they all pretended they felt it too, so the others wouldn't know they didn't belong. Hell, they might have all convinced themselves that they really did feel it. We've had some people on JWN that pretended so much that they felt the spirit that others chimed in and said "Me too" and might have even believed it.

    But as they learned of their power over Ray Franz and others, as they learned that tough decisions had to be made, they learned that they were a force to beware of and they learned to make decisions that they thought were good for the corporation and their own positions.

    I think they still pretend to each other that they feel the Holy Spirit guiding them, but it's more of a "Wink, wink" thing when they do it. It's like when the President of a country says to his staff that "HE" is where the buck stops and "HE" is accountable for whatever happens in "HIS" administration. Everyone else really knows that the president will choose a fall guy to blame and maybe even have someone do some jail time, but they keep their mouths shut and know they will be rewarded and go along with the "Wink, wink" of whatever the boss says.

    I think Ted Jaracz loaded the room with his own yes men and now that he passed, anything is possible in a room without good ideas and everyone knowing that nobody really has Holy Spirit and anyone can spill the beans. It might feel alot like medieval family reunions where everyone is worried that their brother or cousin has hired a hit man to help them move closer to the throne.

    Do they believe their own lies? NO! But not a one of them will admit it to each other or their wives and some will not admit it to themselves. Maybe one of them will one day blow the whistle, but I doubt it.

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