Question for those who believe the bible.

by seven006 82 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

• 

  Realist

  @farkel: hilarious and brilliant!

  @larsguy: hmmm...you are streching the laws of physics a little bit(which god could do of course).

  first of all, blowing the water into space would require winds with a speed of at least 11 km/sec which is about 30 times the speed of sound! (just to clarify this...there are other theories that can explain the presence of water on other planets pretty well!)

  about the canopy...i assume you mean a layer all around the earth...like the air shield in spaceballs :)
  in this case:
  1. how come the sun didn't melt this ice canopy? the radiation from the sun heats up the moon surface to about 100 C during the day!
  2. lets say the ice-canopy was really high up (10000 km above ground...how the water got up there is another miracle). in this case the thickness of the ice layer would still have to be at least 1km to contain enough water to completely cover the earth. (the lower the ice canopy the thicker it would have to be) i think 1km of ice would still filter out all light!
  3. the canopy would have to be centered exactly in the gravitaional center of the earth...otherwise it would crash into the earth. the earth gravitational field is however not 100% symmetrical which would require different ice thickness at different positions (very precise adjustments required...for God of course no problem..but still of the magnitude of a miracle).
  4. i assume the rotaion of the ice canopy should keep it in orbit...the icefields located above the poles would not rotate however and therefor would fall down (unless it is superice that cannot crack and point 3. is fullfilled...with our laws of physics a miracle not even God can pull of).
  5. why didn't the sea animals (including fish) die when everything was flooded with fresh water?

  your explanation would require at least half a dozen full size miracles. why would god use such a elaborate way to kill these people?
• 

  Faithful2Jah

  Realist: You appear to be new here. Don't waste too much time with Larsguy. He is insane. he claims to be Jesus Christ himself returned in the flesh. Even though he admits to be a homosexusl who regularly dresses in women's cloths. No kidding.

  So far as his ice canopy claim. It's utter foolishness. First off the thousands of meteors which bombard the earth daily, most of which burn up in our atmosphere, would destroy any such thing instantly. Second of all the Bible says that on the fourth creative day, long before the flood of Noah's day, our upper atmospher was clear enough to be able to clearly virew the sun, moon and stars to be able to use them for keeping thrack of days and months and seasons and years. Thephases of the moon and the positions of the stars which allow this form of time keeping would not be possible if they were viewed through a mile thick ice canopy. As you point out even sunlight would hardly penetrate such a thing.

  This guy is nuttier than a fruitcake. That's why I sometimes call him "Fruitcake."
• 

  Satanus

  Larsguy is fun. One day he will add his own gospel to the bible. Heck, if he's hot, maybe he'll write a new bible. I'm sure, as a single author (even w multiple personalities) he could do better than the 66 or however many fruitcakes who wrote the original draft.

  SS *heh heh*
• 

  Bang

  I still hold to the thought that the bible is a complete book of myth and folklore and was written by men to control others.

  
  I would say that the story of Noah is written to teach us things and contains many insights into the mystery of God. Just as I don't think Jonah actually got around in a whale, I don't think the story of Noah is an historical account for scientific examination, nor a one week creation 6000 years back. I don't need the stories to be a history to believe the bible - I don't believe Scriptures are meant for the examination of the flesh - it's a spiritual story.

  More to the point would be to be asking "Why an ark, wood? - the clean and unclean animals? - seven days after entering the ark? - the mountains were covered?"
  Such things would be more attuned to a spiritual search.

  If it's history you're into, the bible may not suit you. If it's a sign you're after, well, how come?

  Bang
• 

  Naeblis

  Larsguy. You're a scientific idiot. God help us all if you're his son.
• 

  Farkel

  : So that is how the REALIST BIBLICALIST deal with the scientific aspects of the flood..

  Oxymoron.

  One can be a realist or one can be a biblicalist, but one cannot be both. Unless that one is you of course, Yashua.

  Farkel
• 

  patio34

  It seems that the olive tree would die. This is from Skeptics Annotated Bible:

  Noah sends a dove out to see if there was any dry land. But the dove returns without finding any. Then, just seven days later, the dove goes out again and returns with an olive leaf. But how could an olive tree survive the flood? And if any seeds happened to survive, they certainly wouldn't germinate and grow leaves within a seven day period.

  You ask unanswerable questions, if you discount miracles as miracles are the only way most of the biblical stuff can be explained. That's why faith is demanded so much, i guess.

  About the dinasours, they existed and were extinct long before humans were on the scene. There couldn't have been any large mammals while the dinosaurs existed. There were only little nocturnal mammals as the dinosaurs ruled the earth and daylight. Only when they were extinct did mammals evolve larger.

  Hence, the writers of the bible were ignorant of dinosaurs and they aren't factored in anywhere. Even when Gen. 1:30 says everything ate green vegetation, they were completely ignorant of these millions-of-years extinct predators.

  
  All intelligent people are confrontational.--HBO's Winston Churchill
• 

  Moxy

  owww. naebs comment made me curious enough to actually *read* lars' tome this time. now my head hurts! shut up naebs.

  mox

  Look out! There's a hole in the front of your head and all the stupid is leaking out!
• 

  Solace

  Seven,
  You are downloading a copy of the bible?
  That is so interesting. Let me know how many ink cartrages you go through when you decide you need a printed version.
  

  I believe the bible to be "of God" and "Christian". A book compiled of symbolic and actual events that could be helpful in teaching moral, ethical and Christian values. Being actually written by imperfect men, I think there could be many flaws.
• 

  seven006

  Faithful.

  I was dead serious when I made the statement about my feelings toward the bible and what it says, if I could be given absolute proof the flood did happen. Your right, my mind is set but I am also an open minded person who has no problem admitting I was wrong when I have been proven to be. I did not ask these questions to ridicule or start an argument but really wanted a logical answer. I have asked such questions before and I usually get the same response you have given me. An excuse why you cannot answer and making an assumption about my personal way of thinking is not an answer. It is a simple sidestepping technique that I have seen used by many bible believers simply because they could not answer my questions. The reason they cannot is because myth cannot be explained in a manner that makes it a reality.

  Larsguy,

  You should write for comic book publishers.

  Bang,

  My thoughts about bible myth are simple. In any given situation I try to go back to the very beginning of a situation to start gathering facts about the whole issue. If I find discrepancies in the beginning then it is very hard to believe what is said throughout.

  If the first half of the bible is a myth then it is only logical to conclude that the rest of it is. The ability to use logic and reasoning is the mane process that us humans can use to get at the truth in all matters. When we are told things that are inconsistent, illogical, unreasonable and then are told to simply have "faith" that it is all true is in my opinion the epitome of gullibility. When a salesman comes to me and tells me all kinds of outrageous claims about his product and then says "trust me" my first instinct is to run like hell. I see the bible and those who use it to try and gain members into their religious group no different from the salesman. Simply asking me to "trust you" is only insulting my intelligence.

  Simply asking people to have "faith" that something is true because it might "possibly" be inspired by god is simply a lame excuse to try and give credence to unreasonable and illogical theory. If there is an all seeing and all knowing god I would think he would want nothing to do with mythical stories to try and explain who he was and what he wanted. Maybe the people back when the bible was written were so incredibly uninformed and ignorant about how things work on this planet that it was easy to get away with simply saying "have faith", but not today. Accepting something simply by having faith in someone who claims to represent the supposed originator of such theory is what has caused much tragedy on this earth. Millions have been duped into following thoughts and theories of those who claim to represent god only later to find out they were being used for personal and selfish gain.

  Humans want to beleive in a god and the security such a being would provide. When something is desired so strongly the ability to use logic and reasoning are pushed aside and myth is excepted as fact. When the myth is exposed as such the word "faith" is inserted and people continue to discount facts so that they can cling on to the security of thinking they are safe from all things. Believing you are safe and actually being safe are two very different things.

  Patio,

  I'm not sure your statement about all the dinosaurs is true. Some were still around when humans walked the earth. If they were not, how do you explain many of the cave paintings found in Europe? Several of them depict men throwing spears into woolly mammoths.

  Fark,

  Your explanations make a lot of sense. Believing that god can indeed create anything he wishes I can see the scuba gear theory being a strong possibility. The large drain pipe makes sense also but the dinofest answer is completely stupid.

  Thanks all for your responses, I still have not received any logical answers but then again, I didn't figure I would.

  Take care,

  Dave