Atheists know more about the bible!

by Comatose 157 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  Comatose

  I don't toss out the verses you use. I try to explain why they do not say or prove what you think they say or prove.

  Right, but when you do not even consider the other viewpoint and you speak of you knowing TRUTH, and jesus words to you being proof... Then it's not really a debate. It's one person asking questions and another saying they are 100% right and here is why you are wrong.

  That's what I mean. How could one of us ever try to compare knowledge of the bible to someone with this mind set. lol

  I don't really have a point other than, it is not very genuine or fair to suggest we could even have a discussion. The discussion is always just that you are 100% right and we are wrong and the voice of christ himself told you so, so that ends it.
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  MadGiant

  "if by your question your asking if i believe in the genesis account than yes, i do believe it is literal." - unstop

  Ok, Sir/Ma'am, thank you for your time.
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  unstopableravens

  zound: lol no voices for me, let me say this i like tammy she is very kind and sweet. we both believe in a creator. as far as her voice thing i can speak about what she hears. i think tec and myself believe alot different. i believe in all 66 books being the word of god, i believe jesus is eternal(not sure if she does) i believe in literal hell(i dont think she does) .
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  cofty

  The discussion is always just that you are 100% right and we are wrong and the voice of christ himself told you so, so that ends it.

  And yet it needs to be said over and over and over again regardless of the topic. I find it insulting.

  When Tammy started a new forum for her voice-hearing buddies I thought the madness would end on JWN.
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  Comatose

  Well, looking past yourself and your truth, which you would likely admit is not what most people enjoy, then how do you feel about the premise of the survey?

  Bear in mind that not many christians hear the voice of christ. Most read the bible and live by it and believe it is in its entirety the literal word of god. My family in the JW's fit this, and with all respect to Unstop, he and other christians do too.

  So trying to get back on subject and find a common ground, would you agree that most atheists seem to know more about the bible than christians? You can disagree on whether or not they have the same understanding you do, that doesn't matter.
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  unstopableravens

  comatose: yeah man, i think if you believe in the bible than you believe in the bible lol no parts
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  unstopableravens

  zound: meant to say cant speak for her, no i dont hear voices
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  Comatose

  Unstop - If I was going to believe in the bible I would believe in it all. I did believe it all wholeheartedly for almost my entire life. It was the realization that I couldn't keep doing that which opened me up to TTATT. Once I accepted that some of it couldn't fit for me, I realized the futility of picking and choosing parts of it.

  My main complaint with the world today is that I don't think the bible should influence policy in politics. It's everyones right to believe what they choose. But, I am against allowing it to interefere with other peoples lives. I guess thats why I went from a staunch conservative to very liberal now. ha.. now this is off topic.
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  tec

  Tammy - Does it even phase you how easily you can just explain away the contradictions in the bible?

  No, because I do not do it by my own understanding. But by Christ and His teachings. I started out learning by what was written about Him (added this part to make it more clear)... didn't even know someone COULD hear; didn't even know He was speaking all along.

  Plus, no one ever taught me that the bible was supposed to be inerrant. So I never had that drilled into me, and I never had to overcome this false doctrine.

  Did you ever have a problem with the contradictions before? Have you always felt the way you do?

  I studied the bible for the first time with the witnesses... about 6-7 years ago, I think?

  I did see a contradiction in how God was described, OT... as compared to seeing him through Christ. I didn't know what the reason was for that though or how to reconcile that at first, until I had an 'aha' moment; where I realized that Christ LOVED His father! Christ showed His Father. That IS what is written. Once I saw that, i could more easily see the places in the OT that showed God as CHRIST showed Him also, and more easily see where a description or attribution to God was a result of those who did not know (even if that was a result of the later scribes/translators misunderstanding)

  I did always understand that nothing could contradict what Christ said; Christ being the Truth, and the one God said to listen to. I did learn a lot being here, about what is written... it is just that I had learned FIRST, from CHRIST (and God)... to always look to Him for truth, and to know God. And I understood that there were mistakes made by people; as well as laws given BECAUSE of the hard-heartedness of the Israelites, rather than because that is how God wanted it to be.

  "Moses gave you this law because your heart was hard; but it was not this way from the beginning." Then Christ proceeds to speak as to the Truth of the matter; revealing the Truth of His father's will, as he often did. (you have heard it said; but I tell you now... and his deeds, in not stoning the adulteress but instead showing mercy and forgiveness)

  I actually joined this site to try and explain this point. I had been lurking because I found it from jwfacts (and I was just out of my study, and how horrible I felt about myself after that, which prompted me to start searching the internet for information)

  Would you agree with the premise that most atheists know more about the bible than Christians? Or do you find fault with the study?

  I don't know. Many atheists couldn't care less; they're just living their lives. But atheists who have been hurt by religion... that is another matter. I would agree that some atheists know more about the bible than some, maybe even many, of those who profess to be Christian.

  Peace to you,

  tammy
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  unstopableravens

  comatose: thats very honest. i dont like religion and politics mixing either. i do agree that ppl have the right and should have the right to believe or not believe. i like the example of jesus in luke 18:18-26. this rich man asked jesus what he needed to do to have salvation. jesus told him, the man did not like it and left. jesus did not chase him down and try to convince him or force him to believe. we all have to make a choice. cofty(who i do respect) thinks im willfully ignorant and i think he is. whichever one of us who really is has to want to know the truth, some ppl if there wrong would rather live a lie than come face to face with the truth.