First post (page 9)

Thor

Hi Dog and welcome!

Keep thinking, I wish you well!

Mrs. Thor

I remember when the 1995 change of generation "new light" came out. It was very unsettling, and I asked my husband a couple of questions. He was the WT conductor at the time. He basically said that it made sense and gave me to understand that we shouldn't question. We are both out of the organization now, after more than thirty years in.

I don't know with whom this originated but it is so true: Better to have questions that you cannot answer than answers that you cannot question.

James Jackson

Your wife sounds like my wife, although she has no problems missing meetings, she is very loyal to the organization.

Would like to here more of your story, I too struggle with the "Overlapping, Flipping Generation" explanations.

DesirousOfChange

JAMES JACKSON: I too struggle with the "Overlapping, Flipping Generation" explanations.

My "straw" also was the Overlapping Generation. I find that this was a bigger "New Lite" issue than the new F&DS definition, yet the Overlap Lite is now 3 years past. Does that mean we were contemplating it this long? Or, just stiffling that voice in our head until another screwy batch of New Lite came out?

For me, the GB = F&DS is "Doctrinal" change, but it is how things have been running for decades. The rest of the "Annointed Remnant" were never considered when it came to doctinal understandings. It has been the GB ever since its formation. They just gave token service to the AR.

However the Overlapping Generation is a Game Changer for anyone with years/decades in The Truth (TM) . We made all of our life's decisions on this doctrinal understanding and then all of a sudden RIPPPPPPPPPPPPPP! they yank the carpet right from under our feet. We preached this doctrine about the End. We converted people into the Religion based on what we were taught about the timeline of the System from this Doctrine. We lied. They lied. All the generation of 1914 is dead.

The F&DS New Lite just indicated how much they have had wrong for decades. The evidence is clear, they pull these things out of their ass hat and we are expected to swallow it without question.

Doc

search4truth

Hi thedog1. You may find some, same minded people on http://meletivivlon.com/. Your are not all alone with your doubts. There are many JW realizing that, there is something not quite right.

thedog1

What makes it very difficult is that in the main those in the congregations are very honest, moral people. We were at a wedding recently and it was so well organised and full of love and fellowship. Some will argue that this is not a good reason to stay with something, for the moral values and the feeling of trust and safety, but it does show the power of having a strong moral compass. This wedding had no drunkenness, no swearing, no smoking (waiting for the comments about how it must have been boring then!) but there is a great value in this way of living, despite the doubts about the doctrinal issues. As you can see, these are the main problem for me, as well as the mind control aspect which I find disconcerting.

Phizzy

I was brought up to be a lover of Truth as a born-in JW, I was told that Jehovah was a God of Truth and his people were all believers in the truth.

In all conscience I could no longer remain once I learned it was all lies. Looking in from the outside, yes most JW's are morally upright and good people in most ways.

But most too are prepared to live a lie in a way. Nearly all have a problem with some aspect of the religion, and yet remain in it. That shows a lack in their moral fibre, they are not moral because of their own guiding conscience, but because of their Controllers.

The morality is really as shallow as their faith, which when you challenge and test it is just an emotional thing, no real foundation, based on a theology that is a House of Cards.

I prefer to be part of a group of friends I have chosen whose lives are genuine, not created by 8 men in N.Y, and whose love and friendship for me and Mrs Phizzy is real, and not conditional.

I prefer to keep my integrity in remaining a lover of Truth, like the God of Truth.

rawe

Hi Thedog1,

I recall a conversation I had with one brother[1] about attending his first JW wedding. He was afraid that he would be fearful to get up and dance because at wordly weddings he needed a drink or two to loosen up. But he was surprised how much he enjoyed a dry wedding. Because many of the normal holidays are not part of the faith, it seems weddings in particular are good social time for Witnesses. It is not just that many JWs are good, moral, honest and sincere folks, in some cases, such as my own, Witnesses really did many kind things for me. Growing up on welfare with DF'd parents (my father nonetheless directed me to the Witness faith) meant I had to rely on Witnesses for many basic things, like rides to the meetings. I also often was given meeting clothes, one time even taken to Sears and bought a new suit, top to bottom -- even new shoes, so I would not feel out of place at the covention that week-end. I was even taken in for several months by a Witness family when I had no other place to live.

Perhaps others have had a different experience upon leaving, but for me, it meant an instant shrinking of a circle of friends to almost no one. The first trip we made back to Canada brought this point home. We had to leave our van out in long term parking at the Phoenix airport, because our normal close JW friends that would pick us up, of course wouldn't be there. And... I'll even add, gaining friends on the outside hasn't been that easy. But we've got a few now and each one is a treasure. We of course, now have a easy and more authentic relationship with immediate neighbors, since we've stopped looking for opportunities to 'witness', but instead really listen to what interests them.

Unfortunately, one can reach a moral impasse. Ultimately, to be a faithful and loyal member, entails upholding doctrine and policy as set out by the Governing Body. It also means accepting and odd mix of doctrine, some of which one might completely agree with, such as "no hell fire", "no trinity", to others aspects such as "no beards" one senses is not really Biblical. Or even central ideas like we're living in the last days, Jehovah is blessing his people, yet, one of the "six signs", a reduction in the number of partakers, is silently discarded, when it conflicts with "new light."

Take care,

-Randy

[1] To use a JW terms, because they are familiar.

wallsofjericho

Hi Dog and welcome,

I appreciate your posts, and especially post #15. I agree, that these are very compelling reasons to stay. With changes to my family lately I find myself constantly weighing the "pros and cons" if you will, of staying in "the truth".

fortunately for me, I have found others like me (and like you... elders even) that know TTATT and I can have open, candid conversations with them about life, "the truth", etc.

It can be difficult to always be guarded with your words. It can be draining to never just "be yourself". To do this with your own spouse can take a toll on your happiness if you don't have a really good grasp of what exactly you want out of life.

While I understand why you may want to stay (as I am still in myself) I think, at least for me, is that having been a JW for so long now (all of my life) the idea of being happy in "the world" is a complete unknown to me. I have almost no idea what it would be like to have close, endearing freindships with "worldlies". I think its easy for a JW to dismiss the concept of happiness when it comes to "the world" and for that reason I fear the idea of me being as unhappy and lost as I have always viewed them to be. I have freinds that "partied" for 20 years and then came "back to the truth" and now claim they were never happy in the world.
Problem is, we never meet those that leave "the truth" and actaully become happier, we only ever meet the ones that come back and say how miserable they were in the world

I think understanding what "happiness" really means is the key to actually having it. I hope you can understand, and when you do, please tell me! ;)

Ding

WallsofJericho,

Part of the problem is that because of WT indoctrination, the constant use of terms like "worldly" prevents JWs from seeing the evil within the WTS or the good outside it.

It implies that only virtue is found in the WTS and that non-JWs are all completely abandoned to drunkenness, drug addiction, greed, lust, and the like.

That worldview is as much a lie as the promise that you and I would never grow old in this system of things...

First post