The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday (page 57)

tec

That one is not true ; )

Well, it isn't true, for real. The other defenses I think are shown in what is written, so based at least in part on that. So that there is an example of them, and that is why people suggest them as possible answers. Maybe I'll go through the summary list and see if that is what is happening.

(also... I don't have to go to work after all, the hot water tank busted and i just got called off... so extra bonus day off for me... and no chefs have to do dishes by hand first, boiling hot water to do them... Yay; since it is is also -30 out right now, warming up after our -40 weekend)

Peace!!

tammy

cofty

I ask for advice and get it. Specific help, for example with maths problems when I was at Uni. - Retro

So this undefined being that you seem reluctant to call god, is so involved in our world that he/she/it cares enough and is personal enough and intelligent enough to hear your requests for help.

But..

He/she/it can't or won't prevent the needless death of a quarter of a million innocent men, women and children.

The day you asked him to do your sums, was it 26th December 2004 by any chance?

Summary so far...

Retrovirus

Loaded language much? Listening skills rather less?

So this undefined being that you seem reluctant to call god

Sigh. That's the point. IF THE BEING IS GREATER THAN ME HOW CAN I SAY WHAT IT IS?

He/she/it can't or won't prevent the needless death of a quarter of a million innocent men, women and children.

Sigh. That's the point. IF THE BEING IS GREATER THAN ME HOW CAN I ACCOUNT FOR ITS ACTIONS AND NON-ACTIONS?

The day you asked him to do your sums, was it 26th December 2004 by any chance?

Emotional rhetoric, always easier than addressing the point.

cofty

Retro this is special pleading par excellence.

You believe in something that you refuse to define but you are certain it gives you answers to maths questions.

That is a massive claim of knowledge about this god and what he is capable of, but when it suits you you resort to claims of inscrutibility.

Summary so far...

adamah

TEC said-

All the while avoiding the point... and your end game is no different than your pastor friend's end game, regarding conversion. Just from the opposite angle.

TEC, did you overlook reading what I posted this morning, in response to MissFit's complaint about my posting in a seemingly dismissive fashion? I explained my frustration stems from those posters who feel free to ignore ALL vestiges of common sense and refuse to analyze what they're about to post. The main inspiration was you, and your continued reliance on the childish and pointless "but you did it, too!" (tu quoque) fallacy.

So here we are, only a few hours later, and you're simply throwing up the same drivel, still grasping at straws, using logic that has absolutely ZERO relevance to the question at hand.

And even if it's true, SO WHAT? Isn't it rather obvious to most anyone reading that the pastor likely feels compelled to tend to Jesus' lost sheep (or more cynically, to boost donations and tithes) and Cofty feels compelled to free people from ancient superstitious thinking of belief in Gods?

None of which has anything to do with the price of tea in China, and only distracts from the question Cofty asked:

why did God not intervene to save lives in 2004?

Don't worry if you can't come up with a satisfying answer: theologians have wrestled with the same question for a millenia now, and haven't come up with anything more satisfying than also offering silly distractions.

Adam

Retrovirus

Retro this is special pleading par excellence.

Cofty, it is nothing of the sort. How have I claimed my belief to be special?

You believe in something that you refuse to define but you are certain it gives you answers to maths questions

Do please wash your ears. I never claimed it gave answers to either sums or maths questions, rather new logical approaches. And CANNOT DEFINE does not equate to REFUSE TO DEFINE.

That is a massive claim of knowledge about this god and what he is capable of, but when it suits you you resort to claims of inscrutibility

Right, now not knowing is "a massive claim to knowledge", eh?

To summarise: It is a valid position to believe in a higer power or god but not to be able to account for what it does or doesn't do. Linking to your summary does not refute this.

Retro

zound

@ theists,

Why not select the points from Cofty's excellent list that you are defending and defend them?

Most of the arguing in these type of threads revolve around getting someone to actually honestly answer a question. Cofty is doing well trying to keep the issues on topic - but if you are truly interested in honesty please just address the points you defend.

besty

https://yourlogicalfallacyis.com/special-pleading

You moved the goalposts or made up an exception when your claim was shown to be false.

cofty

Do please wash your ears. I never claimed it gave answers to either sums or maths questions - Retro

Contrast with..

Specific help, for example with maths problems when I was at Uni

Which is it?

Summary so far ..

besty

To summarise: It is a valid position to believe in a higer power or god but not to be able to account for what it does or doesn't do. Linking to your summary does not refute this .

How is that position different to 'its a mystery and I don't don't know whats going on here'?

Belief (ie without evidence) in a higher power or god (very vague) but not able to account for its in/actions (again, no real clue about anything)

That's a pretty soft position you argue for.

The Pastor of my Old Church Tried to Re-Convert Me Yesterday

You moved the goalposts or made up an exception when your claim was shown to be false.

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