All thiose things did happenandevery eye did see, they came toa realisation of who the messiah was whenJeruslaem was destroyed. It is symbolic,metaphoric,hyperbole language. The third temple is built it is spiritual cannot be seen not made with human hands, The disciples were in full expectation of the Mesisas return. He kept his promise ot them , It doe snot compute because oyu ar elooking fo rthe physicalfulfillment of these thingswhen they ar ein fact symbolic. You needot learn about how Jews used apocolyptic language revelation wa sinfact taken from OLd Testament Prophets who used exactly the same language
Revelation written to the 1st century churches
by maccauk11 34 Replies latest watchtower bible
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maccauk11
PLease check out the three hundred videos imade on youtube for more discussion it is called seekchristonly
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Terry
He did in fact come back for them. The historical record of the destruction of Jerusalem and the temple in 70 AD fulfilled exactly as Messiah said some 40 years previously. The return of Messiah was spiritual he came back for them just as he promised in that generation.
I'd agree with you. . .if it could be demonstrated Jesus' prediction weren't written AFTER the fact.
Can it be demonstrated? Alas, no. It can only be asserted.
Occam's Razor calls for the simplest logical rendering of facts. Seems clear enough to me.
Your mileage may vary.
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Cold Steel
Maccuk11: All those things did happen and every eye did see, they came to realisation of who the messiah was when Jerusalem was destroyed. It is symbolic, metaphoric, hyperbole language. The third temple is built it is spiritual cannot be seen not made with human hands....
Okay, show me me one other prophecy where this is so. Please cite the prophecy and the fulfillment.
With all due respect, you’re stretching scripture to fit your own interpretations. When, for example, did “every eye see” and just who came to the realization of the messiah’s identity? How do you know the third temple is spiritual? When the messiah is led into the city through the East Gate of the city and into the temple, is it going to magically appear? The thing about prophecy is, once you start making things invisible, metaphoric and symbolic, you lose ALL credibility. When Zechariah wrote, “Rejoice greatly, O daughter of Zion; shout, O daughter of Jerusalem: behold, thy King cometh unto thee: he is just, and having salvation; lowly, and riding upon an ass, and upon a colt the foal of an ass” (Zechariah 9:9), was that fulfilled symbolically? Was it a spiritual prophecy? No, actually it was a literal fulfillment.
You’re wrong about these prophecies, and most scholars can tell which are the figurative fulfillments and which are the literal. If you have beasts, crowns, scepters, harlots, stars, dragons and such, yes, you can tell when these prophecies are apocalyptic. But when lands, earthquakes and wars are spoken of, you can pretty much figure they’re literal.
The two prophets of Revelation 11, the temple, the “beast” who seeks to destroy Jerusalem and the Jews in the end times are literal and it’s spelled out. Verse 8, for example, speaks of the death of the two prophets. It reads: “And their dead bodies shall lie in the street of the great city, which spiritually is called Sodom and Egypt, where also our Lord was crucified.”
We see here a reference to “the great city.” But what city is it? The apostle says it’s “spiritually” called Sodom and Egypt, which means it will be a wicked city, but not literally Sodom and Egypt. The next verse provides the literal answer: “where also our Lord was crucified.” Where was that? It’s Jerusalem, because that’s where the Lord was crucified.
Since no prophecy is intended for any personal interpretation, the instant you say it’s not what it says it says, you’re putting your own personal spin on it. So then you have to show where it’s invisible, symbolic or metaphoric.
You also stated that one needed to understand how the Jews used apocalyptic language, and you’re correct. But your interpretation shows you lack that knowledge because apocalyptic fulfillment still needs to make sense. So if you have some “key” for unlocking these prophecies, I’d like to hear you explain how to determine when something is spiritual or literal. And why would John be asked to measure a metaphoric temple? And, especially, to leave out the outer court which will be overrun by the gentiles? How can gentiles overrun a metaphoric temple’s outer court? Are they metaphoric gentiles? Are the two prophets metaphoric prophets?
Terry: Occam's Razor calls for the simplest logical rendering of facts.
Occam’s Razor quite frequently goes dull when miracles, prophecy and speaking to God are involved. Thomas Jefferson and other great minds of his day ridiculed the idea that rocks could fall out of the sky. Jefferson is reported to have said in regard to an 1807 meteorite that reportedly fell in Weston, Conn.: “I would rather believe two Yankee professors would lie, than that stones have fallen from the heavens.” Lying, or conspiring even, was, to him, was the simplest logical explanation of the notion that rocks could fall out of the heavens. Occam’s Razor also didn’t work well when it came to the first medical doctors who were said to be quacks because they said germs could cause sickness in people. Many were disciplined for requiring medical staff to wash their hands before procedures or patient examinations.
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Crazyguy
Some great Pionts and counter pionts made here. One questions though In the book Of Revelation chapter 1 verses 1 and 3 its written to show his servants things which must shortly take place and in 3 the time is near. Then go to the end of the book in the last chapter in verses 6,7,10,12,20 all these verses say that hes coming quickly and the time is at hand or near 5 times in just the last chapter. Makes one wonder?????
