NASA Identifies The Hand of God (page 10)

Perry
From Post 4235 of 4262

1) You cannot prove that God does not exist, so He does.(Burden of Proof Fallacy)

Proof is everwhere, from the "Hand of God" to billions of tighly packed information bits found in the DNA to the living cell's hundreds of irreducible complex parts.

No Perry. Facts and evidence of objects and events are everywhere. Proof is quite different. You would have to demonstrate that proof explicitly. So, do you have any? It is a fact that DNA is “tightly” packed with bits of information. Proof of what that means is an entirely different proposition.

2) There is currently no explanation for this, so God did it (Argument from incredulity fallacy)

There is an explanation. Rather, truth be told, there is not reasonable scientific explanation how this design just appeared.

So what would you have instead, Perry, an unreasonable scientific explanation? Or how about no scientific explanation. Assuming there is not scientific anything, how would you determine that your non-scientific conclusion is not based on credulity or the result of a mental aberration? How? Because you feel it. Right? Therein lays the problem. By that measure, anyone who claims anything would be correct in their statement. After all, they believe it and confirm it inside themselves. So, if you encounter someone who has their apartment or house covered on the inside with aluminum foil to stop the rays that read their minds, please believe them.

3) God exists because the bible/qu’ran/torah says it’s the word of said “on true God” /bible, torah, qu’ran quotes (Circular Reasoning Fallacy)

Wrong. There is no "because" , in other words no previous "cause". He is the First Cause which is reasonable to deduce.

And you know this how? Let me guess, you read it in the Bible. No, you have a reasonable explanation (emphasis on the word “reasonable”). Please share. If it’s because you read it in the Bible, please explain how we’re supposed to differentiate that existence in light of all the other things the Bible states that are just plain wrong, contradicting and immoral. If it’s because you feel you can’t reasonably regress to a point where there was nothing, that requires another argument and I guarantee you it’s not in the Bible.

4) Many people believe God exists so he does (Appeal to belief Fallacy)

See above.

See above, above.

5) The bible makes me feel good, so it is true (Appeal to Consequences of a belief Fallacy)

The bible does not make me feel good at all. I cannot participate in my own salvation. This insults my pride. Jesus said I must give up everything to get everything, this insults my sensibilities, He says his saved are children, brothers, but also slaves, this upsets my notions of freedom until I compare Christian "freedom" with slavery to sin, vice and death.

Wow, what a miserable book. I’m sorry I’m not attracted to a book that constantly reminds me how worthless I am and dangles a carrot in front of me to make me believe how rewarding it will be in the end. Of course, no one has ever been there to give us any confirmation that it will be great. Never mind all that about what Jesus says. How can you be sure of anything you read about Jesus when the very source of such information is cast into doubt? Wait, you don’t cast that source into doubt, right? It’s because you’re sure about because it says so, which makes you feel it, which confirms what it says. Notice any circularity of reasoning there? That’s what you’re doing.

6) I had a personal encounter with God, so it is true (Anecdotal Evidence- Jews and Muslims do as well)

Personal testimony is high quality evidene if it is from a credible witness. 40% to 60 % of all Muslim converts to Christianity are doing so because of personal encounters with God through dreams.

And yet, Islam is the fastest growing religion in the world (1.86% as opposed to 1.3% for Christianity). Perry, please. Personal testimony is quality evidence that you had an experience. That’s all. It doesn’t tell you if that experience adheres to reality. It could be totally convincing. That doesn’t mean it’s real. Some people hear voices that are not there for others in the same room. Are they real? Hmm…I’m not saying that believing correlates to having Schizophrenia. I’m saying that the mind is a complicated thing and we need to use our faculties to rid ourselves from delusion.

7) I prayed to God and I was cured (Post hoc ergo proptor fallacy)

Unless of course its true.

OK. Mention an example. And, don’t trot out what Jesus did back in the First Century. That narrative is questionable and self referent. Tell me about an incident that happened in your church. Tell me that it wasn’t that someone had a head ache and prayed and God took away the head ache. And if it’s not as obvious as that, compare such a happening to what happens to a person who goes into Cancer remission by thinking positively and by believing in the power of the mind.

8) Ontological* Argument (Fallacy of Misplaced Concreteness)

*Because we think something perfect can exist it therefore does exist. Also Existence is wonderful. God is wonderful therefore God has existence.

Unless of course he inhabits believers and they can feel his presence inside them. Then, it isn't just "thinking"

So, your evidence that He inhabits believers comes in the form of what? Let me guess, personal testimony that only you can verify with nothing that I can attest to other than what’s inside your head. Very convenient. Let me think: Is it because you know many people who also attest to the same thing? OK. On that basis, you would have to believe that there are UFOs with ETs that torture cattle and kidnap humans in order to perform experiments on them. Think about it. The exact same rules apply here.

9) Bible prophecies (Circular Reasoning Fallacy+Red Herring Fallacy+ Self-fulfilling Fallacy+Composition Fallacy+Equivocation)

Fulfilled Bible Prophecies are powerful evidence.

OK, I’m going out on a limb here. Tell me which Bible prophecies have been fulfilled. Tell me what has transpired that is different in fulfillment than what many people interpret Nostradamus predicted. Tell me about what has transpired as a Bible prophesy that would not be obvious to people who watch the world. Is it “wars and rumors of wars? OK, then. We can tackle that, although I’m sure it’s been covered many times on this forum.

10) *ignores argument * Argues about something else (Red Herring Fallacy)

Christians are not saying that they can out argue someone on whether or not God exists. They KNOW he does because he lives inside them.

Look at item 6 in the list.

11) *ignores argument * You don’t believe in God because you’re dumb, atheist! (Personal Attacks Fallacy 'ad hominem')

Not dumb. God's existence implies accountability, judgment. This is scary stuff. However, the good news is that there is nothing that you can do to improve your situation as someone who will face judgment one day. It has already been provided for you. If you receive him.

I look at your answer as a great cop-out for personal responsibility. I once worked with a “Christian” (a fairly young man) who was a deacon at his church and counseled youth. He had called me over to see about a tool box he’d found and proceeded to bust the lock to take the tools. In an unrelated conversation, he told me that he was saved because Christ died to provide that salvation and that no matter what you did, once you accepted Him, you could not forfeit your salvation. That explained to me his readiness to steal what did not belong to him. I’m illustrating here how such beliefs are up for grabs, even if you yourself are forthright and sincere. But my “friend’s” example implies the lack of accountability.

12) This is all just lies and slander as expected from an atheist (Genetic Fallacy 'ad hominem')

Mostly just well-founded fear disguised as logic.

Do you detect fear in my statements? On the other hand, I detect fear in you of the consequences resulting from not following what you interpret and believe. The Bible contains many texts stating or suggesting how one should fear the Lord. The Lord has given many examples in the Bible of how he deals with those who don’t fear him. That is not a nice God. How is it possible that an atheist can have fear in something s/he does not believe in? How about an atheist having fear of the triumph of religion over atheism? Is that it? Hmm…No. I don’t think that’s it.

NASA Identifies The Hand of God

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