To: Psychdigg - What about the Children?

by Amazing 22 Replies latest jw friends

  • Amazing
    Amazing

    Psychdigg: I just got on the board again and saw your post about Bill Bowen.

    In typical JW-style you attack the person rather than the issue of child molestation. Your quote of one of Bill's posts in your thread: http://www.jehovahs-witness.com/forum/thread.asp?id=27390&site=3 is not at all valid evidence of Bill being vengeful, or losing perspective - but rather he points out the shear hypocrisy of the Watchtower so-called system of justice. A system that is wholly unchristian and uncivil by any reasonable standard of measurement ... except maybe with radical extremists groups.

    Against the normally wise comments of Kismet regarding ignoring people who jump out with personal attacks as you have done, I have decided on a different course. Most of my life I 'turned the other cheek' - but - as another very wise person once told me, there is a point in life where if you keep turning the other cheek, your head will spin off.

    You conveniently side-step the serious sex crime issue prevalent in the Watchtower Pedophile Paradise - just as the Catholic Church officials have done so - and now it is coming home to roost. I would say that the Watchtower and the Catholic Church are two peas in a pod, except that at least Roman Catholics are speaking out against this crime, and not side-stepping and making excuses for their church.

    Please adress the following:

    What about the many thousands of JW children harmed by the cover-up of pedophiles in the organization? Do you care about them or their parents?

    What should be done with the JW leaders who have directed JW Elders to not report pedophiles to authorities?

    What about the lawsuits now taking place and that have taken place with respect to JW children who have finally gooten the courage to speak out ... and while civil society is giving them some sense of real justice, they have ended up shunned by their own JW friends? they have been made victims twice.

    Do you have any concept at all as to how terrible this crime is? Do you see that the very fact that JW parents typically do not report this crime is because they are either afraid of being shunned, or they are so blinded by misguided loyalty that they act more to protect the marketing image of their religion than the more improtant interests of their own children?

    Are you at all aware of the long term damage to children who have been molested? Do you understand how this impacts their relationships in life, and their own future marriages?

    Show some balls to address these issues. Stick with debating how this best can be resolved. Deal with the best help and healing available to these children.

    Those who care about truth and serious issues "do not" shoot the messenger, as you are attempoting to do by attacking Bill Bowen; rather, those who care about truth and are honest with themselves, stick to the issue, deal with and debate solutions to the concerns, and address the message head on.

    The Watchtower leaders are dodging and side-stepping because they cannot face the truth. Why? Because were they to openly deal with the truth, they would have to close their religious publishing business, give the money to the victims, and admit to their followers their complicity ... and stop the chrade that they are some kind of special agents of God.

  • alamb
    alamb

    Another issue that may be being missed:

    The abuse has been going on for generations. I am now an adult who was molested over 2/3 of my childhood. MY CHILDREN are now in danger from my pedophile father due to contact being allowed through the congregation without my consent or knowlege. He is an admitted pedophile. There are court records to prove it and a restraining order in place that is ignored. I am disassociated but my children have contact through my ex who is still actively in denial.

    This is a generational issue with many faces.

  • Stephanus
    Stephanus
    To: Psychdigg - What about the Children?

    They can rot, apparently. That seems to be Psychodogg's goal - bulldoze the one champion the abused little ones in the org have.

  • Psychdigg
    Psychdigg

    Of course. The Children. The most vulnerable people on earth.

    Bowen has never established that JW's have more cases of Child Abuse than the general population. I have seen figures that 1 out of 3 females and 1 out of 4 males claim they were sexually molested when they were children. Legal cases don't reflect those large numbers because it is apparent society in general doesn't handle this very well.

    Yet Bowen continues to sensationalize the JW situation with speculation about JW's being a hot bed of molestation. JW's promote strong family values. They openly discuss sexual matters as congregations. They don't allow those in leadership positions to watch even R rated movies. They frown on obscene jesting. They require chaperones on dates. They condemn songs with suggestive lyrics. They encourage moderate "non-sexy" dress. There is a whole lot of penis management going on. And they even throw out members who practice wrong-doing. The general wholesome mileu does more to prevent molestation than any amount of catching molesters in the act.
    If individual elders screw up they deserve to be sued. If the GB screw up they deserve to be sued also.

    Do you think humans will ever solve the problem by law enforcement? Parents have an obligation to keep an eye on their kids. Are the methods of child molesters some hidden secret? I have always been suspicious of any and everybody who is too friendly to my kids. My wife and I never NEVER had a night out because we didn't want anyone watching our kids. If there was a wedding and we couldn't bring our kids we just wouldn't go. We never even allowed our own kids to play in a room with the door closed. We weren't paranoid and neither of us were ever molested. What baffles me is that parents who themselves were molested allow the same things to happen to their kids. Go figure.

    Bill Bowen is not helping kids. He is mobilizing hatred for an organization IN THE NAME OF helping kids. He's going to experience a big let down some day when the reporters quit calling and the TV crews stop taping.

  • DakotaRed
    DakotaRed
    MY CHILDREN are now in danger from my pedophile father due to contact being allowed through the congregation without my consent or knowlege. He is an admitted pedophile. There are court records to prove it and a restraining order in place that is ignored.

    ALamb, if there is a restraining order in effect and it is being ignored, I would drag all of them into court so fast their Watchtowers would lose their ink. Get that restrainig order enforced! If they still refuse, have the ex'es visitation terminated!

    If God's Spirit is filling a Kingdom Hall, how is it that Satan can manuever the ones within that Kingdom Hall at the same time?

  • larc
    larc

    Brother Psych,

    I don't even know where to begin with you. With all the restrictions regarding sex, that is found in the religion, then stuff still does happen, does it not? Now, because it goes on in the outside world, does not mean it should go on among God's choosen people, and when it does, God's people should take immediate action, but they have not. They have shielded the wolves among the sheep, to the harm of the congregation. I think you know that.

  • DakotaRed
    DakotaRed
    Do you think humans will ever solve the problem by law enforcement?

    It's not a matter of solving the issue, but rather, of protecting innocent ones from now on. That the Society turned a blind eye and allowed this conduct to proliferate is abomniable!

    Parents have an obligation to keep an eye on their kids.
    Parents cannot lock their children up. If they do, many dubs go to the elders and accuse you of excessive abuse and such. Been there, done that, DA'd over it after years of accusations. Many dubs simply take over anothers kids and are allowed to by some within the congregation. As a step parent, if I complained, I was told, "you just don't want them to have any fun." When I mentioned the dangers of having a 25 year old "brother" sniffing around the 14 and 16 year girls, I was told I was hopelessly old fashioned, overbearing and an asshole.

    When trying correct children, often some elder or his elderette wife would interfere and "protect" the kids. I never before realized that grounding a kid from an after meeting ball game was abuse, but I guess it was. When I complained, I received a "visit" from the elders and was summarily reminded that since I was inactive, my words held absolutely no merit within the hall.

    The list is much longer, but as long as the elders and their childless wives take over the kids and run interference for them, how do you propse to protect them?

    Are the methods of child molesters some hidden secret?
    Pedophiles operate in secrecy, don't you know that? As long as their presence is known to but a few and hidden from those with children, you can expect their vile deeds to proliferate within the Kingdumb Halls.

    I suggest you pull your head out of the Watchtower long enough to look around you and see what is really going on. How can the Watchtower condemn the Catholic Church for covering up pedophilia while they are even more guilty of it themselves? How can they claim to have an "aggressive policy of dealing with them," when they deny it even exists, although time and time again, it has been proven in court? How can they be God's channel of communication when they refuse to clean up those within their ranks and instead, attack the vicitms of this molestation?

    If God's Spirit is filling a Kingdom Hall, how is it that Satan can manuever the ones within that Kingdom Hall at the same time?

  • Haereticus
    Haereticus

    "Bowen has never established that JW's have more cases of Child Abuse than the general population."

    I think I saw this phrase before by the same author. It would certainly make an impression to me if this very society would accept situation where equal amouts of criminal activity is tolerated. It would be another ray of new flickering light.

    I am tempted to think that disfellowshipping should then restricted only if wrondoing exceeds the figures of that "general population".

    I am fortunate having sane father who's wisdom made up what my JW mother was short of.

  • Gozz
    Gozz
    *Bowen has never established that JW's have more cases of Child Abuse than the general population.
    *Yet Bowen continues to sensationalize the JW situation with speculation about JW's being a hot bed of molestation.
    *JW's promote strong family values.
    *They openly discuss sexual matters as congregations.
    *They don't allow those in leadership positions to watch even R rated movies.
    *They frown on obscene jesting.
    *They require chaperones on dates.
    *They condemn songs with suggestive lyrics.
    *They encourage moderate "non-sexy" dress.
    *There is a whole lot of penis management going on.
    *And they even throw out members who practice wrong-doing.
    *The general wholesome mileu does more to prevent molestation than any amount of catching molesters in the act.
    *If individual elders screw up they deserve to be sued.
    *If the GB screw up they deserve to be sued also.

    You have a personal thing againt Bill Bowen? You're an authority on JW. So with all the phallic management what do you think is happening? And why are JW policy makers suddenly waking up? Have you read the letters to the Bodies of Elders about handling child molestation cases? Are you aware of the policies? You say Bill Bowen is speculating; you are insulting the sensibilities of men, women, and children who have suffered due to Watchtower policy.

    There are other questions you are yet to answer:

    Amazing:

    What about the many thousands of JW children harmed by the cover-up of pedophiles in the organization? Do you care about them or their parents?

    What should be done with the JW leaders who have directed JW Elders to not report pedophiles to authorities?

  • HildaBingen
    HildaBingen

    Mr larc:

    I am concerned when anyone begins to malign any organization like some here have maligned the JW organization. If there are serious cases of pedophilia going on among the Witnesses, these problems need to be addressed ASAP. But floating exaggerated numbers of child abuse or flat out and out lying about some matters is wrong.

    The early Christians had their share of problems too. There were sexual sins occurring in Thyatira and the elders there were wrongly permitting these sins to happen. Our resurrected Lord told those elders in no uncertain terms, he did:

    "Nevertheless, I do hold this against you, that you tolerate that woman Jezebel, who calls herself a prophetess, and she teaches and misleads my slaves to commit fornication and to eat things sacrificed to idols."

    Revelation 2:20

    Our Lord further told those elders who were slacking that he gave that old prophetess time to repent but she was not willing. He then said that he was gonna throw her into a sickbed full of tribulations and horrors. I think Jesus gonna do the same thing today, dear. Leave things to my bridegroom and he will take care of you, hon.

    "Rejoice in him,
    who the many did not see on earth,
    although they ardently cried for.
    Rejoice in that which is on top."

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