Kicking the "Gay Habit" at the IC

by breakfast of champions 56 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

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  DJS

  Quendi,

  Beautifully spoken. Thank you. I've pointed out in other OPs on this subject that those who support hate against the LGBT community, whether it is in support of someone who doesn't want to bake a cake, take a photograph or otherwise refuse service to the LGBT community or allow them to marry, etc. are contributing to suicides and deaths (Matthew Shepard as an example). The intolerance shown by people, including their language and 'political' and social beliefs, affects those around them. They don't operate in a Libertarian, egoistic, Borg (resistance is futile), theist vacuum, even if they think they do. There is a lot of bloodguilt, IMHO. As for the Borg, with this, the blood issue and others, their hands are deeply stained with the blood of innocents.
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  NotNew

  To the opening post...thanks, your point is well taken.

  Let me set my mind on gays straight...If u feel you are attracted is to someone of the same sex...go for it...see if it is the right choose for you, if not then make the change. I will not make a judgement!

  SW
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  breakfast of champions

  QUENDI Beautifully spoken indeed.
• 

  BackseatDevil

  QUENDI Beautifully spoken indeed.

  I agree.

  I have to say something before anyone else does this:

  It's an arrogant human tendency (albeit natural) to assume that just because something does not apply to you personally, it should then be deemed a “privilege” universally. If you are not affected, then there is no reason to evolve as a whole just because of a few people's belly-aching.

  I hear this a lot with white people using every sort of argument under the sun to justify using the n-word. Because there is not a racial equivalent for white people, it is automatically deemed and “overreaction” if someone responds badly to a personal decision of use because “I took out the -er and substituted and -a” or “I wasn't talking about ALL black people, just the ones that give black people a bad name.”

  You know what? It's NOT my word, it's NOT my offense, it's NOT my realm of comfort and for such, as you notice, I avoid the word at all cost. It's not my place to justify ANY use of it as it's not my history's weight. And I don't try to offer plastic sympathy of relateability to something I cannot relate to... although I can understand some as I am gay and have been called the f- word from someone out of anger. But even that doesn't come with centuries of oppression.

  Today, people can hide racism in MANY different ways with the nicest smiles and the sweetest baked goods. Different races is natural. It happens in every singly species of animals. Apprehension about race is NOT natural... it only happens in one species of animal... Humans. Homosexuality is natural... it happens in over 1500 species of animals. Apprehension about homosexuality is NOT natural... it only happens in one species of animal... Humans.

  Just because someone doesn't “get” why people feel one way or another gives no reason why universal laws and sanctions should be made whether it be church or state. If one person doesn't understand how it feels to love A PERSON, then they should have no say in the matter. Just because you don't feel something doesn't mean it's not felt by others.

  As you may note... I have a low tolerance on people trying to sympathize with a plight they can't imagine... only to shrug it off as nothing... nothing more than a bad habit. Love is love, the gender isn't as important as the emotion. The only people who make gender a focus are those who are put limits on the humankind's capacity to love.

  SEX, is a different subject and is step two, but it's pointless to discuss unless one first has a working knowledge of step 1 above.
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  LisaRose

  Backseat Devil, well said.

  I find that people sometimes think that the way they think, the way the are sexually and the way they relate to the world is how other people are. That is a mistake because we are all so different. I asked Notnew if he remembered choosing to be heterosexual, because so many people believe homosexuality is a choice, when it is not. I don't remember choosing heterosexuality and I dont think anyone else does either. It is simply the way I am, which was an easy thing because that is accepted in society. While it is getting easier for gay people, it is still difficult to go against the norm and there are still some people who will never accept it, so I don't think anyone chooses to be gay, it just is how they are.
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  Finkelstein

  Must remember that religionists like the JWS position themselves that homosexuality is a learned

  behavior because its deemed a sin against god and nature, making an ackowlement that people are

  genetically born that way would not make it a sin, something detestable in the eyes of god so to speak.

  .

  Unfortunately the ancient Hebrews didn't understand human genetics, homosexuality may have been

  detestable in the eyes of the Hebrew high priests at the time as in other civilizations in that era of human history.

  .
• 

  Finkelstein

  Sister Mary says there is no such thing as a Habit for Gay people, we vow celibacy

  while being married to the Lord.

  
• 

  steve2

  Well expressed Quendi and BackseatDevil. This topic is worthy of your powerfully articulated observations.

  The unfortunate "fruit" of the prayer-driven denial is men ( and women) sincerely putting themselves on a path of faked sexual re-orientation that has far too often led to "sham" marriages which may yield children. Sooner or later the supposedly re-oriented spouse realizes they have fallen victim to religious pressure and belatedly feel compelled to 'fess up. Now, their religiously-induced fakery results in a broken marriage. If the men had simply been accepted - and no claim made to re-orient them - there would have been no need to "prove" their re-orientation with its sad fruitage.

  Shame on the Watchtower and all other fundamentalist religions who pressure their young into a deluded lifestyle change involving vainly 'praying the gay away'.
• 

  AnnOMaly

  Not an interview. A related experience.

  East Rutherford IC.

  Fri. a.m. - David Splane - Keynote Address: Highly Esteem Present Kingdom Blessings! [Relevant excerpt. Direct quote.]

  Another brother tells how he overcame a particularly difficult problem. He says,

  'It was especially difficult to abandon my homosexual practices as these have been a part of me as long as I can remember. One thing that helped, though, was a change in my environment. I ended my old friendships, and stopped going to bars and nightclubs. Although it was not easy to make these changes, I found comfort in learning that Jehovah cares for me and that he understood my struggle. By 2002, I had stopped all homosexual practices and in that year I was baptized as one of Jehovah's Witnesses. My mother was so impressed by the changes I made that she also began studying the Bible. For the past 8 years, I've been engaged in the full-time ministry.'

  But then he adds, realistically,

  'I must admit, that I've had to fight improper desires at times, but I take courage that in choosing not to act on these desires I can be pleasing to Jehovah. Drawing close to Jehovah and living in a way that pleases him, has boosted my self-respect, and today I am a happy man.'

  Well, your heart goes out to a brother like that. He could have thrown his arms up in the air and said, 'What's the use? Why should I keep struggling?' But he didn't. He kept struggling and he's finally overcoming his habit, and Jehovah is blessing him. And what does this show? This shows that even strongly entrenched habits, desires that we may have had right from childhood, are no match for Jehovah's powerful holy spirit.
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  DJS

  Thank you AnnOMaly,

  "Right from childhood"? Splane has to know better. By using those words he damn well knows there are genetic factors. Backing away from 'choice' and edging cautiously toward the womb and conception, huh? Since they all are likely afraid of girl parts, that's probably as close as they will ever get to acknowledging the conception/genetic factors. Does he think that makes him sound Smarter? Kinder? Gentler? More Understanding and Compassionate?

  He and the rest of the Dark Lords are evil little men with hands stained from the blood of innocents. I hope that someone from the Dark Tower is reading this.