Is Blood Thicker Dan Water

by non_trias_theos 88 Replies latest watchtower beliefs

  • non_trias_theos
    non_trias_theos

    $$$the context is the qualifications of elders. The examples were un christian behavior, lying, slander, keeping up jewish myths and commandments of men....16..They profess to know God, but by their deeds they deny Him, being detestable and disobedient and worthless for any good deed.$$$

    Paul is talking about qualifications of elders. However notice that he says elders should reprove those who contradict the faith. He is referring to those who have apostate tendecies. Then he talks about those deceivers of the mind who insist on Christians being circumcised. These are the ones subverting households. They are those who, if they do not accept the counsel of loving elders, become apostate.

    $$$

    Non worships God and him alone.
    How do you know God is a he?$$$

    God is not really a he. He is not a she either.

    $$$Our family of over 20 years has been severely disrupted because of the Watchtower Society - not because of God, and I pray everyday it is not permanent. I am NOT a JW.$$$

    Jesus said that he came to cause divisions among families. Jws only divide families in the sense that Jesus divided families. We do not try to destroy families by df members.

  • Will Power
    Will Power
    apostate tendecies. Then he talks about those deceivers of the mind who insist on Christians being circumcised. These are the ones subverting households. They are those who, if they do not accept the counsel of loving elders, become apostate.

    Subverting yes because they put all emphasis on laws. Whether to be circumcised or not, what food to eat, etc. the word apostate is not here, it is suggested that these men full of themselves and their yokes are what subvert the faith. They make people think that the laws are the faith. This I am afraid is your belief as well.

  • non_trias_theos
    non_trias_theos

    $$$Subverting yes because they put all emphasis on laws.$$$

    Read the text: "these very men keep on subverting households by teaching things they ought not for the sake of dishonest gain" (Titus 1:11). They are apostates.

    $$$Whether to be circumcised or not, what food to eat, etc. the word apostate is not here, it is suggested that these men full of themselves and their yokes are what subvert the faith.$$$

    Read the text. To insist on circumcision and teach things one ought not is heresy. The word does not have to be there.

    $$$They make people think that the laws are the faith. This I am afraid is your belief as well.$$$

    Christians are not law-less. The faith must have certain laws to prevent spiritual anarchy and antinomianism.

  • dmouse
    dmouse

    Firstly, let me say that I agree with a religion’s right to expel members whose behaviour they deem incompatible with their ethos. I have no problem with that. However, I do have a problem with the way that disfellowshipped ones are treated afterwards.

    The act of permanently shunning another human being, and especially members of your own family, is abhorrent, wicked, evil and barbaric.

    I am not interested in scriptural reasoning. Show me a scripture that supports shunning in the way that the WBTS does it and I will tell you that scripture is WRONG. In any case, scriptures can be twisted, misapplied, misinterpreted and generally screwed around with to support any belief system. To paraphrase the famous line: All scripture is inspired by ancient peoples, and totally useless for setting things straight in this modern world.

    People are often disfellowshipped not because of gross immorality but simply because they question the teachings of the WBTS. Either that or they are considered to have disassociated themselves – there is no distinction between disassociation and disfellowshipping in reality, both result in enforced shunning. You may ask ‘what company does not expel members who do not keep to the companies rules, or who no longer wish to be a member of the company? I hate these twisted analogies, that start out trying to portray reasonableness but in reality are a perverted excuse to hurt people who no longer believe as you do. I ask you in return: ‘What company will expel a member and then insist that all current members no longer talk to such ones?’
    What is the real purpose of disfellowshipping? Is it an act of love to bring erring ones to their senses? Why, in the vast majority of cases, does it not work then? The real purpose of disfellowshipping is control. The WBTS use it to keep the congregations in order through this rule of fear. How can someone follow their heart and try to worship God in truth when they know that this will mean expulsion and shunning? When such ones try to help others to leave they are treated worse than lepers. Because of the subtle and not-so-subtle methods used to threaten congregation members that they are to avoid disfellowshiped individuals or face disfellowshiping themselves, the act of disfellowshiping is no longer a form of trying to help someone. It is no longer a form of loving or even less than loving discipline. It is not discipline at all, but a form of controlling individuals who step out of line. Many are faced with the prospect of losing family and friends or being forced to toe the party line.

    Let me ask you something, Non, have you ever had the pain of shunning a family member? Until you have, you can't spout out about what a loving thing it is. I know, first hand, the pain and trauma of shunning someone you love. Being forced to do something like that against every axiom of my being hurt so bad...

    My sister was disfellowshipped after she tried to commit suicide, her JW husband having left her for another woman. She wanted nothing more to do with the JW religion after that and this was seen as a sign of unrepentance. JESUS CHRIST! My own sister was hurting bad to the point of nearly ending her own life. And you know what I did? I slavishly followed those old bastard’s guidance and didn’t speak to my own sister for years! It changed forever the love we had between us. How I look back and hate myself for what I did.

    Forget scripture, forget procedure, forget the meaningless platitudes dribbling out of the Brooklyn sewers, use your own conscience – in your heart you know that shunning is wrong, and that it does indeed split families and friends apart.

    For God’s sake, get yourself some balls, and get yourself some morals.

  • Will Power
    Will Power
    Christians are not law-less.

    True, they have the law written on their hearts. They are not bound by the laws of men.

  • non_trias_theos
    non_trias_theos

    Christ's law is written in the hearts of christians. but it is also written in the Bible. Grace is not a license to sin. God clearly lays out his commands in the Bible.

  • Dutchie
    Dutchie

    The real "religion" of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society cult is simply to spend as much time as possible in "field service" selling their literature. Everything they do is geared to that. Even your spiritual weakness of spiritual strength is judged by how much time you spend in field service. All of your problems will be solved if only you spend even more time in field service. They even have a weekly sales meeting so that you will be more effective selling their literature and seeking more people to recruit into the "publishing" work.

    You, Non, whether you will admit it or not, worship a publishing company. You worship a multinational corporation whoes main objective is printing numerous books and magazines to be peddled from door to door.

    You accuse others of being brainwashed? You use Bible scriptures to defend them? Its absolutely pitiful. You believe that the Governing Body is the Faithful and Discreet Slave mentioned in the Bible? Why do you believe that? Simply because they told you to believe it, and you do! Who then, is brainwashed?

  • non_trias_theos
    non_trias_theos

    $$$The real "religion" of the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society cult is simply to spend as much time as possible in "field service" selling their literature.$$$

    Non does not sell literature. He gives it away in fs.

    $$$Everything they do is geared to that. Even your spiritual weakness of spiritual strength is judged by how much time you spend in field service. All of your problems will be solved if only you spend even more time in field service. They even have a weekly sales meeting so that you will be more effective selling their literature and seeking more people to recruit into the "publishing" work.$$$

    No one is dumb enough to believe that all problems are solved by fs. I do not believe that. But Jesus is the reason I go out in the ministry. He commanded his disciples to make disciples. Even if there was no command in the bible, non would still go from door to door teaching others about God, Christ and grace.

    $$$You accuse others of being brainwashed?$$$

    Many here are brainwahsed. Not all.

    $$$You use Bible scriptures to defend them? Its absolutely pitiful. You believe that the Governing Body is the Faithful and Discreet Slave mentioned in the Bible?$$$

    No. The fds is all of God's anointed on earth at any given time.

    $$$Why do you believe that?$$$

    I do not.

  • Dutchie
    Dutchie

    Well, Non, surely you realize that the reason you no longer "sell" the literature is not because of altruistic reasons, but because the WTBTS was advised by the lawyers who run the organization that if they accepted money at the doors, they would have to pay taxes on that money. So now we just accept "contributions" for the "world wide preachinhg work." Slick, huh?

    Despite what you may preach, Non, the main message to be conveyed at the door has always been the same. If you don't become a Jehovah's Witnesses and go from door to door "giving away" literature, you are going to die at Armegeddon. Period. All that other stuff you say is just window dressing leading up to the big "A" warning.

    Don't forget Non, when you get your magazines you make a "contribution" for them, so the watchtower has their money. I guess they don't really care what you do with them after that. If you can get "contributions" from the householder that's okay, but if not, well, just as long as they get paid...

  • non_trias_theos
    non_trias_theos

    $$$Well, Non, surely you realize that the reason you no longer "sell" the literature is not because of altruistic reasons, but because the WTBTS was advised by the lawyers who run the organization that if they accepted money at the doors, they would have to pay taxes on that money. So now we just accept "contributions" for the "world wide preachinhg work." Slick, huh?$$$

    Non does not even ask for contributions. He received free and he gives free. So you know not what you say about non. He is altruistic.

    $$$Despite what you may preach, Non, the main message to be conveyed at the door has always been the same. If you don't become a Jehovah's Witnesses and go from door to door "giving away" literature, you are going to die at Armegeddon. Period. All that other stuff you say is just window dressing leading up to the big "A" warning.$$$

    One can go from door to door all he want. It don't mean he going to get life. You have misunderstood what jw say, if you believe that bunk. What about being ethical, moral and obeying the comamnds of God? You can preach all day but if you fornicate or get drunk day in and out, you ain't gonna git life.

    $$$Don't forget Non, when you get your magazines you make a "contribution" for them, so the watchtower has their money. I guess they don't really care what you do with them after that. If you can get "contributions" from the householder that's okay, but if not, well, just as long as they get paid...$$$

    I would love to see how the wt makes all this money off of magazines like the wt and ak. You people just do not know what time it is.

    And are you gonna admit you wrong about the jw understanding of the fds. Jws do not think that fds is governing body. You misunderstood, missy.

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