Does the soul or spirit exist?

by JanH 37 Replies latest jw friends

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  JanH

  Robyn,

  I found this link interesting: http://www.cfpf.org.uk A group of quantum physicists say they have mathematical proof that consciousness survives death.

  Thanks for sharing.

  I read through what I assumed to be the main "heavyweight" article on that site, "The Scientific Proof of Survival After Death". I was somewhat surprised to see that the author Michael Roll did not make any attempts whatsoever to justify his doctrine, but instead concentrates on attacking a perceived conspiracy of almost all the world's scientists. As can be expected, he subscribes to a number of long-discredited ideas, and rejects without evidence Einstein's theories of relativity. Whatever his creditentials are, it is easy to see from his writings that he's gone off the far edge of sanity long ago.

  Considering how much almost everyone would like to believe in an afterlife, it's not very sensible to believe that scientists should try to cover up actual evidence that it exists. I suspect emotions are what drives these pseudo-scientists, not hard facts. If they had any facts, beyond dodgy soul photographs, why don't they present them?

  It is a common pattern from crackpots of all types to cry about censorship and conspiracies when their odeas are rejected. It is obvious why peer reviewers turned down Roll's writings. They have nothing to do with scientific work.

  I for one, would very much like to not die. But given the evidence, I simply can't fool myself. Roll and others like him obviously can.

  - Jan

  Edited by - JanH on 9 June 2002 21:53:41
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  Realist

  @ jan:

  again a perfect post!!! bravo!
• 

  borgfree

  JanH,

  Two acorns were having a discussion. One acorn was arguing that there was a much better life to follow after they died as an acorn. He believed they would live a much fuller life than they could expect as an acorn. The other acorn thought the first one was out of his mind. He said, you have no proof that there is any other life for us, than we are now living.

  The bible uses a similar reasoning.

  1 Corinthians 15:35-44 NIV

  35 But someone may ask, "How are the dead raised? With what kind of body will they come?" 36 How foolish! What you sow does not come to life unless it dies. 37 When you sow, you do not plant the body that will be, but just a seed, perhaps of wheat or of something else. 38 But God gives it a body as he has determined, and to each kind of seed he gives its own body. 39 All flesh is not the same: Men have one kind of flesh, animals have another, birds another and fish another. 40 There are also heavenly bodies and there are earthly bodies; but the splendor of the heavenly bodies is one kind, and the splendor of the earthly bodies is another. 41 The sun has one kind of splendor, the moon another and the stars another; and star differs from star in splendor.
  42 So will it be with the resurrection of the dead. The body that is sown is perishable, it is raised imperishable; 43 it is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory; it is sown in weakness, it is raised in power; 44 it is sown a natural body, it is raised a spiritual body.
  If there is a natural body, there is also a spiritual body.

  Borgfree
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  ashitaka

  Nice post.....good stuff. I was thinking about this today.

  ashi
• 

  Robdar

  I just found the site interesting. It doesn't matter to me if we survive death or not. What matters is what we are doing with our life right now.

  I am trying to have enough fun for 3 lifetimes, while I have the chance.

  Love,

  Robyn
• 

  Amazing

  I'm working on it.

  Don't know what happened.

  Edited by - Amazing on 9 June 2002 23:1:18
• 

  Psychdigg

  Jan:

  The Bible is a unique religious book for that very reason. Most of it views the soul as the organism itself. This is an idea that is finally appreciated by psychologists.
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  JanH

  Amazing,

  You have just made this page totally unreadable. Can you please fix that message?

  Ty,
  - Jan
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  Satanus

  To say that science has not disproved the idea for all intents and purposes is fooling oneself.

  M y theory is that, as we are on the earth, discovery of other planes, spiritual or whatever else there may be, is not necessarily a vital part of the plan.

  I just did a thorough search of my apartment for elephants. With my preconcieved idea of what they look like, it was pretty easy. There are no elephants in my apt. But that doesn't mean that elephants don't exist. And so, scientists with their knowledge base, methods, and areas of search fail to turn up empirical proof. Does that prove absolutely that spirit/soul doesn't exist? No. Jan knows this, and that's why he said 'for all intents and purposes'.

  Can existence of spirit/soul be proved? Who knows? Here is the experience of dannion brinkley, who was hit by a lightning bolt. The phone on which he was talking was melted. His body/machine shut down for 28 minutes. He has a story to tell of those 28 minutes, when his body was dead. Here is some of it. http://www.near-death.com/brinkley.html

  SS
• 

  Satanus

  What science knows about the human body and the evolution of humanity does have some consequences for a soul-belief, however.

  Actually, most buddhism believes in both evolution and souls/spirits. They believe that as nature evolves, so do spirits. They think 'god' is evolving. Eastern religion see the cosmos and everything that exists as an organic, growing form. They believed in evolution long before darwin thought of it.

  SS

  Edited by - saintsatan on 9 June 2002 23:34:28