So is anyone looking up California legislators on websites and contacting them, even though you're out of state? How about contacting anyone you know inside the state who'd help out on this? Can't just sit back and assume it'll pass on its own.
WTS soon to be in World of Hurt !!!
by Amazing 43 Replies latest jw friends
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Amazing
Hi Nancee:
However they split into different corporations in the U.S, so that the account is also in effect now divided. If a victim sues an elder who molested her and wins, then the assets are according to the new paper trail to come from the new corporation called the Christian Congregation of JWs which deals with personell such as elders, CO's, DO's.
Yes, they reorganized their main corporations in October 2000. This matters not according to the attorney I worked with not long ago. Here is how it works. Say that a victim wins a judgment against Watchtower Bible and Tract Society, et al, and assuming the judgment is sizable. Then, the plaintiff attorney will motion the Court to issue Citations for Discovery of Assets ... and with some advance work done, they can name ALL corporations and subsidiaries, checking accounts, savings accounts, stocks, bonds, real estate, equipment, inventory, and anything else of value. God help the Society should they be stupid enough to conceal anything of value from the court, especially those assets named or cited.
I am in the middle of this right now, where my client has won a judgment ... and now, we are going after a party who took assets and moved them to other accounts and names not associated with our civil suit ... we are now going after the party's car, house, business, commercial real property, stocks, 401K plan, etc. Yet, the defendant was only a agent for the party we sued and prevailed over ... sooo ... believe me, if enough victims of molestation win sizeable judgments ... the Watchtower religion will bleed shades of green for years to come on their way to Chapter 7 Bankruptcy.
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dungbeetle
Go Amazing go go go !!!!
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Siddhashunyata
Amazing, in historical cases would the courts consider tracing the "lineage" of liability? For example would they find the WTBTS liable as it existed at the time of the "molestation"and simply impute that liability to the present transfigured corporate "persona"?
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dungbeetle
Watchtower comes full circle.
Back in the early 1900's maria Russell sued CT Russell for support. She won, and she won handsomely. Russell then, honest-hearted person that he was then <gag> <choke> took his money and gave it to the Watchtower. It didn't work. The court ordered Russell to pay or else.
Then, Russell gave the money to a new Watchtower. It didn't work again. So then Russell gave the money to a new Watchtower in a different state. That STILL didn't work. Finally, to keep Russell out of jail, his followers scraped up $9000 to pay the debt FOR HIM.
(See "Visions of Glory, Barbara G. Harrison)
It didn't work a hundred years ago and it sure as h**l won't work now.
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Liberated
My son is taking the bar in California this year and this is one of the first things I'm going to have him read......he's studying for it right now and doesn't have the time, and may not afterwards. But I intend to pepper him with questions.
Such as, how would the wts be held accountable rather than only individual elders, or only the individual perpetrator? The wts will cut them loose to save itself, you can be sure of that. Rather than the org heading for bankruptcy, wouldn't it be the elders themselves, their own personal assets? So will it have to be proven that they were acting as agents for the wts and carrying out its policy and how is that done?
Libby
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ItsJustlittleoldme
Hi Amazing,
Yikes!!! Ugh is right - I could not agree with you more. Could it be that I am starting to forget the JW mentality?
Congratulations, you're becoming more and more free every day!!!! -
Amazing
Thanks for the feedback:
First, Libby: There are currently three cases I know about where attorney Jeff Anderson has filed civil suits on behalf of JW vicimts of molestation. One in New hampshire, on in Washington State, and I believe the other was in Wisconsin or Michigan. The suits, as I understand them, name the JW Molester, the JW Elders, JW family, the JW congregation, and the Watchtower Bible and Tract Society of New York 'et al' as Co-Defendants ... at trial the plaintiffs will try to show the responsibility and culpability of each party. They will seek monetary damage awards from each defendant. The defendants may share the same attorney, but likely will have their own attorney's and try to show that they are not responsible apart from the actions of other parties named, or will try a separate settlement or try to get a separate trial for themselves. Yes, you can ask your son, and I am sure he will provide some interesting comments and state some intriguing possibilities.
Dungbeetle: That is news to me. I was aware that Maria won a judgment, but was not aware of how large it was or the difficulty she had in collecting it ... I will have to get a copy of Barbara's book. Thanks for sharing that important piece of information.
Siddhash:
Amazing, in historical cases would the courts consider tracing the "lineage" of liability? For example would they find the WTBTS liable as it existed at the time of the "molestation"and simply impute that liability to the present transfigured corporate "persona"?
It's possible. Let me illustrate what happens in real estate. Suppose in 2002 you buy a property from me that you later learn has a toxic spill, perhaps oil from a leaking oil tank that was never propery repaired or decommissioned. And I did not disclose this to you, and I could and should have known about the tank. Then in many states, you can sue me, every owner back in the chain of title all the way back to when the tank was first installed ... and this wuld include every owner, and real estate agent on both sides of every sales transaction. This is already establish case law in some states, specifically back in Oregon wher I ran into this issue as a Realtor, and was so advised by our company attorney.
So, let's say that a JW was molested in California in the mid 1950s ... and assuming that California abolishes the Statute of Limitations as is planned for the new legislation ... and assuming the victim can make the case that the JW Congregation leaders (before the Elder arrangement they just had servants) and the Society failed to protect them - resulting in a JW molester continuing to occupy positions of trust and allowed access to JW children ... then it seems it would follow that the victim could hold the religion liable ... likely suing the Elders, the congregation, and the Watchtower Society as co-defendants. I imagine that a more currently dated event would be easier to name, find, and serve all parties. What will be interesting is to see the final version of the California legislation and to see IF it passes and then gets signed by the Governor.
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dungbeetle
It's very simple.
Watchtower in its literature ordered its members (even before baptism) to not speak of the crimes of other JW's to anyone except the elders. Period. This was in the Lamp book, the Organization book, the Organized book, dating from 1967 onward to this year.
So IN PRINT we have Watchtower telling parents they should not report molestation of their children, elders not to report molestation, children not to report their molesters, or they will be guilty of gossip/reviling/slander or whatever and in line for expulsion/shunning themselves.
And in addition, this means rapists will be going to people's doors.
IN PRINT.
This isssue is SOOOOO over. Watchtower is SSSOOOOOOOO going down.
In 1957 Wiliam Schnell predicted that Watchtower, if it goes down, would do so becasue of its literature.
YEAH!!!!!!!!
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SYN
Hehehe, I can just picture the talks in Congregations all over California the day after this legislation is passed, there will be many "Moving to where the need is greater, i.e. helluva far away from California, preferably to Mexico, especially you Elders" talks given!
EXCELLENT! They are finally getting their just deserts.