The Inherent Goodness Fallacy (page 3)

Siddhashunyata

Is it coincidental that the tree that caused sin to manifest is called "the knowledge of Good and Evil" ? This business of judging " good and evil" seems to be the root of a sinfull mind does it not?

Labelling everything as good/bad, good/evil is doing a lot of damage. In his actions, jesus was not judgemental of sinners. Unlike jw's and pharisees, he accepted sinners w open arms, warts, leprosy and all. True some judgemental words are put in jesus' mouth. They conflict w his actions. Makes one wonder if the guys who wrote the gospels really understood what jesus was about.

For those who like to divide all humans into good/bad categories, consider that 98% of the human genome is animal. If these actions/desires/drives are judged, why not start judgeing animals and their actions as well? Actually the ot jews did just that. And so, the whole animal kingdom was divided into clean/unclean. All nonjews were, of course unclean, in the animal category. Supposedly jesus came to remove the barriers. Supposedly, peter recieved a vision while he was tranced out, telling him everything was now clean. Jesus', as per bible, demonstrates this removal of good/bad, clean/unclean barriers among people.

People like paul/saul and comforter, and cults like to reach back to the ot, and smack peoples' consciences w it. Why can't people just be more accepting of others as they are?

SS

comforter

Dakota

You have misunderstood what I am saying. I do not deny that non jws can be kind at times. But I still think that most people (jw or not) will do evil most of the time unless they make conscious efforts not to do so and rely on God. I too think that the bad outweighs the good in this world. And I don't even have to look for it. It is there for everybody to behold.

SS

You guys are being inconsistent. You go on about child molestation and lying, as you should. But your actions on this board indicate that you do believe there is such thing as good and bad. Surely child molestation is inherently bad, is is not?

And fyi, I cannot just accept abusers, drunks, and sexual perverts as they are. I must be true to myself, the scriptures, and the dispprobation that such actions cause in my heart.

Comforter

Bang

Comforter,

Good is good and all else simply falls short. Christ said "I want kindness", not, "I want goodness". He knows we fall short and accepts us as we are, encouraging us to improve. He does not judge us, His word judges us, as we hear it.

As for Matthew 5:21-22, is it the case that you have an altered bible? An nwt or something? If I say "you fool" to an arrogant jw, I don't go to gehenna, I'm simply become liable to the same judgement, so I'd better be 'damn' sure of myself - ever hear that one? Well, when it comes to jw fools, I'm sure, 'damn' sure.

bang

Edited by - Bang on 14 July 2002 0:24:11

comforter

Bang

"But I say to you that if you are angry with a brother or sister, you will be liable to judgment; and if you insult a brother or sister, you will be liable to the council' and if you say 'You fool,' you will be liable to the hell of fire." (Matthew 5:22 RSV)

Comforter

DakotaRed

Comforter, I disagree. I think most do kind acts for the most part. But, the bad things a few do get all the media coverage while the kindness goes unreported. I believe the majority of JWs are also inclined to be kind too. But, the teachings and trappings of the Watchtower Society often prevent them from doing so.

Like I said, I have witnessed life at it's worst and at it's best. The kind acts of starngers are there, but they get little attention today. Maybe the reason the bad acts make such headlines is that they are relatively infrequent yet result in such huge loss of life, whereas the kind acts of many are so frequent, they just go unnoticed. You know, like not seeing the forest for the trees.

Car wrecks kill thousands more a year than airline crashes, but which gets all the media attention? It's that infrequency that grabs the headlines.

Start looking around you at the kindness displayed everyday, from simply holding a door open for a person to maybe first aid being administered at a wreck. A kind word given at the bus stop to a total stranger or just a simple wave. They are there and often, do make a difference. But, we take them so much for granted, that we often forget the kind simple acts around us.

It's there, all you need do is look.

Lew W

hillary_step

Comforter,

The wicked ones have been perverts from the womb;
They have wandered about from the belly onward. - Psalm 58:3

What does this mean?

So when you speak of 'bad', do you speak of 'wicked', or 'sinful', as you know Biblically speaking these definitions are not synonymous? Is every person inclined to be wicked, if so is this scripture insinuating some sort of genetic transfer of wickedness, or some blight of birth?

As I have asked before, give me some sensible definitions by which debate can take place. For example I gave you this statement to comment on and you remained conspicuously silent about it:

When the Jews were asked by God to slaughter the Caananites, man, women and child, were their actions 'good' actions or 'bad' ones. Your theology would surely dictate that they did a 'bad' act to achieve a good end? Of course many would argue with this and suggest that they did a 'bad' act for a 'bad' end, but what you need to do is to present evidence for your assertions.

You are either a troll as some suggest, or not very bright as others suggest, I am hoping though, that there might be a third conclusion and that I am missing something here.

Best regards - HS

edited for punctuation...

Edited by - hillary_step on 14 July 2002 0:34:56

Bang

Comforter,

Read it again, and again. "liable to the fire of hell", doesn't mean "sent to hell".

Don't worry, as precarious as it is, I'm "damn sure".

bang

Satanus

May i direct comforter to his scriptures

Luke 7 2 And a certain centurion's servant, who was dear unto him, was sick, and ready to die KJV
Luke 7 2 And a certain centurion's servant, who was dear unto him, was sick and at the point of death. ASV
Luke 7 2 An army officer had a servant whom he loved. The servant was sick and almost dying.WE
Luke 7 2 And a certain centurion's bondman who was dear to him was ill and about to die; DARBY

It was a common trendy practice for the richer folk at the time to have a boy as a catamite. This was probably one of those cases, as the centurion expresses endearment towards this young guy. What was jesus' response? No rebuke, only commendation

Like7: 9 When Jesus heard these things, he marvelled at him, and turned him about, and said unto the people that followed him, I say unto you, I have not found so great faith, no, not in Israel. KJV

SS

Edited by - saintsatan on 14 July 2002 0:38:9

Edited by - saintsatan on 14 July 2002 0:40:49

OUTLAW

Birds of a feather,flock together. I am not evil,nor are my friends or the people I associate with...You say you are evil,and everyone your around is evil.This is what you attract in your life because this is how you are.You are not welcome to put your filth on other people...OUTLAW

The Inherent Goodness Fallacy

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