How Do You Feel About Indian Mascots? (page 2)

Kenneson

An interesting letter to the editor appeared in today's paper on the topic. See "Displaying a macabre trophy at FSU" by Arthur J. Remillard

http://www.tallahassee.com/mld/tallahassee/2002/08/17/news/editorials/letters/3879786.htm

While I attended FSU, a group of us re-established the Native American Indian Association, and we lobbied to have it become an agency at the university. The reason we did this was that there was no agency, office, anything, to support American Indian students at FSU. There are no faculty or staff who are enrolled members of federally recognized tribes. They do not recruit Indian students. So, a university that claims to have a proud "indian" heritage does nothing to foster and encourage the Indians who attend their college.

FSU has never, ever recieved permission from any of the Seminole tribes, including the Florida Seminole tribe that is recognized by the US, to use their name as a mascot. (They also do not pay the FL Seminole tribe, or the OK tribe for that matter, a dime for the use of the name either) They do not see how this negatively impacts the Indian students that go to school there. If you tell anyone you went to FSU, usually they will say, oh so you are a Seminole? And I say, no I am Cherokee. One time, an old lady who was working at a gas station saw my hat that had Florida State on it, and asked if I was a Seminole and I just said no (cuz I am not) and she said, well that is just as well cuz I am a Gator fan and we like to kill them Indians. (nice huh?)

This issue is not silly, and it does affect everyone, not just Indian people. It presents a complete distortion of history, all in the name of sports. It is an absolute shame that we have educational institutions perpetuating this miseducation. It is important for all people...Indian, black white whatever, to learn the history of our nation. If the only education that the future leaders of this country ever get about Indians is what they see at Doak Campbell Stadium, how will they ever be able to deal with the bigger issues in Indian country such as land and mineral rights, racism, treaty rights, gaming, etc etc?

I learned more about political manuevering in two years that I led that student organization than I ever dreamed possible. I think the defining moment that made me start really speaking out about the mascot was at a game...watching the Clemson tigers doing their silliness with the crowd...and seeing the stupid white boy who had his face painted red sitting on a horse pretending to be one of the greatest southeastern Indian heros there is.....all for a football game. Fake silly tigers and Oceola.....it was sad.

You have to know your past. The mascots create an reality where it is impossible to know the truth about our past. I am against them.

This website has alot of good info:

http://www.aimovement.org/ncrsm/

jst_me

Just one more thing...the word "Tallahassee" means ghost town in Creek.

larc

I Think FSU should change it's name from the Seminoles to the Casino Owners, a tribe in central and northern Michigan.

I don't see the use of Indian names as demeaning at all. Schools pick names that represent power and courage, so I see the use of such names as a sign of respect.

Oh, by the way, I thought the Washington Redskins were named after the red skin potato.

nilfun

I had a dream about a certain country.
They wanted more living space.
The leaders of this country decided to accomplish this by
rounding up a certain "race" of humans by killing them
and concentrating them into camps.

It was genocide.
The death and destruction wrought upon those
targeted by the leaders of this country was horrifying.

Time passed. This country abandoned their policy.
Some people reflected on the bravery that
was displayed by members of the "race" their
government had previously targeted for
elimination. It was decided that a great way to honor
these admirable traits was to use this "race"
as a mascot for various sports teams. As an added
bonus, their religious symbols would also be incorporated
in the pre/post game excitement.

It was accepted by many as harmless fun.

The dream horrified me.
The country was Germany.
The "race" targeted for elimination were Jews.

I awoke in a cold sweat.
Gradually, my breathing returned to normal
and I comforted myself with the thought that
it was only a dream.

I mean, who in their right mind would think something like that was okay?

BeautifulGarbage

Palm Springs High school's mascot is an Indian. Actually, the teams are called The Indians. I don't recall anyone ever making a big fuss about it. Most of the Indians here(Agua Caliente tribe) are very wealthy because they own half the land in Palm Springs. They rake in a fortune in leasing fees. My MIL's house is on Indian leased land. Plus, they just opened a big new casino in Rancho Mirage in partnership with Donald Trump.

What I do recall is when the new high school in Palm Desert was built in the late 80's there was a big controversy about their chosen mascot, the "Sun Devils". That sure whipped up the fundies in an uproar. Before it was settled, I moved away from the area. When I returned 8 years later, I noticed that PDHS mascot is called the "Aztecs". Fundies won that one.

BeautifulGarbage

And another thing.............

The University of Notre Dame uses The "Fighting" Irish as their mascot. I'm half Irish and it's never bothered me. I guess the Russian/German part of me finds it amusing.

wow..Irish/Russian/German! Three reasons to drink!

Ok..It's late

Good night, Gracie.

plmkrzy

"Sun Devils".

They sent that over to "Jerry McQuire" lol

All I can say about this mascot crap is I am sure happy that I don't place my idendity and values in FOOTBALL games Nor do I learn history from them.

Thank Gawd. I feel for those who do.

I know my roots and my history and none of it was due to football.

jst_me

This statement actually shows the negative power for the mascots:

Oh, by the way, I thought the Washington Redskins were named after the red skin potato.

Let me explain why. That word, "redskins", comes from a time when hunters were paid for Indian scalps. They would bring the bloody scalps of Indian people to trading posts, where they would recieve a certain amount per Indian that they could prove that they had eliminated. The wives of the traders did not like hearing about how many scalps were brought in, so the trading posts referred to the bloody evidence the same way that they did other animal skins that were brought in, so the hunters would get paid for racoon skins, bear skins, deer skins, and REDSKINS.

The word carries the same connotation as the "n" word. Most dictionaries say that it is a slur. Call an Indian that and you will most likely get cussed out. It is ironic that the football team in the nation's capitol insists on using it as their mascot, especially after they lost the copyright to it becuase the US copyright commision recognizes that it is a slur.

As far as the argument about Notre Dame, that is an Irish Catholic institution, and they chose to name themselves the Fighting Irish. Most of the Indian team names were chosen at a time when Indians still had no rights whatsoever, they could not even dance or perform religious ceremonies. Notre Dame actually played a game not too long ago and the opposing team brought out some guy dressed as a priest acting all crazy, and Notre Dame refused to play until apologies were made. So, they are able to control the religious imagary that they use and that their opponents use. That does not happen with teams with Indian mascots, because the people who control the mascots are not Indian, they have just made up their little rituals without considering what may be sacred, and that some things are inappropriate for the football field.

Usually there is not alot of fight about these names, especially in New England and in the South, because there is not much of an Indian population since they were removed. It is very hard for the people who do remain to speak up because usually you are all alone, against alot of people who say the same things that are being said here. I had an incredibly hard time last year with TEACHERS saying ignorant things to my son at school, and I just gave up because it was so hard...they had no clue and I just wanted my son to get through it all. Ignorance makes people say very hurtful things, and then when they are presented with an alternate view of their reality, people can become downright nasty. All we want is to go to school, and to be able to do that without the negative imagary that comes along with the Indian mascots.

BeautifulGarbage

Jst_me,

I very much appreciate your giving the history of where the term "redskin" came from. Indeed, I can understand why it would be upsetting to Native Americans.

My "argument" was not such. It was merely an observation. I would have no problem with the changing of what mascots are called.

Just as long as it is not demeaning to women .

I loath the term "rule of thumb" because it comes from old english law that allowed a man to beat his wife at his discretion. Just as long at the stick, or rod, was no thicker than his thumb.

Andee

How Do You Feel About Indian Mascots?

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